Follow KQED’s reporting on criminal justice issues.
Trial for Class Action Lawsuit Over Troubled Women’s Prison Slated for June 2025
BONUS: The Whistleblower Playbook | S2: New Folsom
David DePape Sentenced to 30 Years in Federal Prison for Attack on Nancy Pelosi's Husband
Prosecutors to Push for Terrorism Enhancement in Sentencing of David DePape, Who Bludgeoned Paul Pelosi in 2022
SF Jury Acquits Man Accused of Castro Hate Crimes After Nearly a Year in Jail
Family of Man Suffocated by Antioch Police Restraint to Get $7.5 Million Settlement
'We Approach in Peace': Are BART's Efforts to Help People in Crisis Working?
Antioch Police Targeted Black People With Dogs and 40mm Launchers, Suit Alleges
Neighbors to Rally in Support of Black SF Man Who Received Racist Threats
State Prisons Offset New Inmate Wage Hikes by Cutting Hours for Some Workers
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She previously reported on public health and city government at the San Francisco Examiner, and before that, she covered statewide education policy for EdSource. Her reporting has won multiple local, state and national awards. 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Nik’s reporting interests include policing, public health, environment, immigration, housing and the points where these issues intersect.","avatar":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/e391b3a18ce4a53a7ca3f3065c74418b?s=600&d=blank&r=g","twitter":null,"facebook":null,"instagram":"https://www.instagram.com/nikaltenberg/","linkedin":null,"sites":[{"site":"news","roles":["author"]}],"headData":{"title":"Nik Altenberg | KQED","description":"KQED Contributor","ogImgSrc":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/e391b3a18ce4a53a7ca3f3065c74418b?s=600&d=blank&r=g","twImgSrc":"https://secure.gravatar.com/avatar/e391b3a18ce4a53a7ca3f3065c74418b?s=600&d=blank&r=g"},"isLoading":false,"link":"/author/naltenberg"}},"breakingNewsReducer":{},"campaignFinanceReducer":{},"firebase":{"requesting":{},"requested":{},"timestamps":{},"data":{},"ordered":{},"auth":{"isLoaded":false,"isEmpty":true},"authError":null,"profile":{"isLoaded":false,"isEmpty":true},"listeners":{"byId":{},"allIds":[]},"isInitializing":false,"errors":[]},"navBarReducer":{"navBarId":"news","fullView":true,"showPlayer":false},"navMenuReducer":{"menus":[{"key":"menu1","items":[{"name":"News","link":"/","type":"title"},{"name":"Politics","link":"/politics"},{"name":"Science","link":"/science"},{"name":"Education","link":"/educationnews"},{"name":"Housing","link":"/housing"},{"name":"Immigration","link":"/immigration"},{"name":"Criminal Justice","link":"/criminaljustice"},{"name":"Silicon Valley","link":"/siliconvalley"},{"name":"Forum","link":"/forum"},{"name":"The California Report","link":"/californiareport"}]},{"key":"menu2","items":[{"name":"Arts & Culture","link":"/arts","type":"title"},{"name":"Critics’ Picks","link":"/thedolist"},{"name":"Cultural Commentary","link":"/artscommentary"},{"name":"Food & Drink","link":"/food"},{"name":"Bay Area Hip-Hop","link":"/bayareahiphop"},{"name":"Rebel Girls","link":"/rebelgirls"},{"name":"Arts Video","link":"/artsvideos"}]},{"key":"menu3","items":[{"name":"Podcasts","link":"/podcasts","type":"title"},{"name":"Bay Curious","link":"/podcasts/baycurious"},{"name":"Rightnowish","link":"/podcasts/rightnowish"},{"name":"The Bay","link":"/podcasts/thebay"},{"name":"On Our Watch","link":"/podcasts/onourwatch"},{"name":"Mindshift","link":"/podcasts/mindshift"},{"name":"Consider This","link":"/podcasts/considerthis"},{"name":"Political Breakdown","link":"/podcasts/politicalbreakdown"}]},{"key":"menu4","items":[{"name":"Live Radio","link":"/radio","type":"title"},{"name":"TV","link":"/tv","type":"title"},{"name":"Events","link":"/events","type":"title"},{"name":"For Educators","link":"/education","type":"title"},{"name":"Support KQED","link":"/support","type":"title"},{"name":"About","link":"/about","type":"title"},{"name":"Help Center","link":"https://kqed-helpcenter.kqed.org/s","type":"title"}]}]},"pagesReducer":{"root-site_criminaljustice":{"type":"pages","id":"root-site_15622","meta":{"index":"pages_1716337520","site":"root-site","id":"15622","score":0},"parent":0,"pageMeta":{"excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"adSlotOverride":"300x250_news","WpPageTemplate":"page-topic-editorial"},"labelTerm":{"site":""},"blocks":[{"innerHTML":"\n\u003cp>Follow KQED’s reporting on criminal justice issues.\u003c/p>\n","blockName":"core/paragraph","innerContent":["\n\u003cp>Follow KQED’s reporting on criminal justice issues.\u003c/p>\n"],"innerBlocks":[],"attrs":[]},{"innerHTML":"","blockName":"kqed/post-list","innerContent":[],"innerBlocks":[],"attrs":{"useSSR":true,"seeMore":true,"query":"posts/news?tag=criminal-justice&queryId=34c136d48d"}},{"innerHTML":"","blockName":"kqed/ad","innerContent":[],"innerBlocks":[],"attrs":[]}],"publishDate":1581369306,"title":"Criminal Justice","pagePath":"criminaljustice","headTitle":"Criminal Justice | KQED","content":"\u003cp>Follow KQED’s reporting on criminal justice issues.\u003c/p>\n\n\n\n\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","modified":1690471663,"headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","socialTitle":"Criminal Justice Reporting | KQED","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Explore the latest news and analysis on criminal justice in California - from police reform to mass incarceration with KQED's Criminal Justice Reporting.","socialDescription":"Explore the latest news and analysis on criminal justice in California - from police reform to mass incarceration with KQED's Criminal Justice Reporting.","title":"Criminal Justice Reporting | KQED","ogDescription":"","imageData":{"ogImageSize":{"file":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","width":1200,"height":630},"twImageSize":{"file":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"},"twitterCard":"summary_large_image"}},"slug":"criminaljustice","status":"publish","format":"standard","path":"/root-site/15622/criminaljustice","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>Follow KQED’s reporting on criminal justice issues.\u003c/p>\n\n\n\n\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"label":"root-site","isLoading":false}},"postsReducer":{"stream_live":{"type":"live","id":"stream_live","audioUrl":"https://streams.kqed.org/kqedradio","title":"Live Stream","excerpt":"Live Stream information currently unavailable.","link":"/radio","featImg":"","label":{"name":"KQED Live","link":"/"}},"stream_kqedNewscast":{"type":"posts","id":"stream_kqedNewscast","audioUrl":"https://www.kqed.org/.stream/anon/radio/RDnews/newscast.mp3?_=1","title":"KQED Newscast","featImg":"","label":{"name":"88.5 FM","link":"/"}},"news_11987292":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11987292","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11987292","score":null,"sort":[1716404721000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"trial-for-class-action-lawsuit-over-troubled-womens-prison-slated-for-june-2025","title":"Trial for Class Action Lawsuit Over Troubled Women’s Prison Slated for June 2025","publishDate":1716404721,"format":"standard","headTitle":"Trial for Class Action Lawsuit Over Troubled Women’s Prison Slated for June 2025 | KQED","labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"content":"\u003cp>The trial for a class action lawsuit against the Federal Bureau of Prisons over sexual assault and retaliation at an \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11978712/infamous-east-bay-womens-prison-hit-with-12-additional-sexual-assault-lawsuits\">East Bay federal women’s prison\u003c/a> is slated to start in June of next year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The brief virtual court hearing comes during a turbulent time for the prison embattled in sexual assault charges. It is the first public hearing since federal officials \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11982973/feds-abruptly-close-east-bay-womens-prison-following-sexual-abuse-scandals\">abruptly closed Federal Correctional Institution, Dublin\u003c/a>, last month.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Wednesday, attorneys for both sides outlined the next steps and a timeline for the class action lawsuit filed on behalf of women formerly incarcerated at the prison last August.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What’s clear coming out of the case management conference today is that the case has not and will not end with the closure of Dublin, and we will continue to fight on,” said Amaris Montes, an attorney with Rights Behind Bars, representing plaintiffs. “We know that the problems exist outside of the physical walls of Dublin, and the same things are happening at other BOP facilities.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Attorneys for both sides discussed possible settlement solutions for the lawsuit on Tuesday; however, an offer still needs to be made.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We are seeking real, lasting changes in the BOP system, including medical and mental health care that’s meaningful, so we don’t plan to settle until we have these changes,” Montes said in a press conference shortly following the hearing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Allegations of sexual abuse at FCI Dublin date back decades, including a major settlement case plaintiffs won in the 1990s. The most recent series of scandals first started unraveling following an investigation by The Associated Press in 2021. It revealed a culture of abuse and cover-ups that had persisted for years at the low-security federal women’s prison, which had more than 650 inmates before shuttering.[aside postID=news_11980960 hero='https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/GettyImages-1181905632-1020x680.jpg']Eight former FCI Dublin correctional officers, including the former warden and chaplain, have been convicted and charged and seven have been sentenced.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Since 2021, formerly incarcerated at the Federal Correctional Institution, Dublin, have filed nearly 60 lawsuits alleging a range of sexual harassment violations and retaliation by officers. That includes the class action lawsuit, which started public proceedings on Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Earlier this year, U.S. District Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11982014/judge-chooses-top-pick-for-special-master-to-oversee-womens-prison-following-rampant-abuse\">ordered a special master\u003c/a> to oversee mandatory changes at the prison following years of sexual assault allegations and criminal charges against eight officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Shortly after, Wendy Still was appointed to the position; however, the Biden administration announced that the facility would shut down.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Women who were housed at the facility have since transferred across the country to a small handful of other women’s prisons. Some women have since alleged mistreatment and retaliation during the relocation process and in their new facilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>According to a recent court order, Still will continue in her position even though the prison has closed. She will report on conditions at the prison before and during the transfer process and monitor how women are doing at the facilities they were transferred to.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We are hearing egregious reports of abuse and neglect, conditions of housing that’s dangerous, overcrowding and understaffing and medical needs that aren’t being addressed,” said Erin Neff, an advocate with California Coalition for Women Prisoners. “I am very encouraged by Gonzalez Rogers’ decision to continue the special master’s role for the 600 individuals who are now across the country.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Gonzalez Rogers responded by calling the \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11985645/closure-of-california-federal-prison-was-poorly-planned-judge-says-ordering-further-monitoring\">closure and transfer process “ill-conceived”\u003c/a> and ordered close monitoring and care of women at their new facilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People are vulnerable to retaliation. People still face unconstitutional conditions of confinement, a lack of medical care and so much more,” Montes said. “This is clear; this is a result of not just individual officers who are committing abuses, but it’s an issue of BOP-wide policies that have continued to allow people to suffer.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"The class action lawsuit filed in August 2023 alleges sexual assault and retaliation by officers at FCI Dublin.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1716406893,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":17,"wordCount":684},"headData":{"title":"Trial for Class Action Lawsuit Over Troubled Women’s Prison Slated for June 2025 | KQED","description":"The class action lawsuit filed in August 2023 alleges sexual assault and retaliation by officers at FCI Dublin.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Trial for Class Action Lawsuit Over Troubled Women’s Prison Slated for June 2025","datePublished":"2024-05-22T12:05:21-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-22T12:41:33-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"sticky":false,"nprStoryId":"kqed-11987292","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11987292/trial-for-class-action-lawsuit-over-troubled-womens-prison-slated-for-june-2025","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>The trial for a class action lawsuit against the Federal Bureau of Prisons over sexual assault and retaliation at an \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11978712/infamous-east-bay-womens-prison-hit-with-12-additional-sexual-assault-lawsuits\">East Bay federal women’s prison\u003c/a> is slated to start in June of next year.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The brief virtual court hearing comes during a turbulent time for the prison embattled in sexual assault charges. It is the first public hearing since federal officials \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11982973/feds-abruptly-close-east-bay-womens-prison-following-sexual-abuse-scandals\">abruptly closed Federal Correctional Institution, Dublin\u003c/a>, last month.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Wednesday, attorneys for both sides outlined the next steps and a timeline for the class action lawsuit filed on behalf of women formerly incarcerated at the prison last August.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What’s clear coming out of the case management conference today is that the case has not and will not end with the closure of Dublin, and we will continue to fight on,” said Amaris Montes, an attorney with Rights Behind Bars, representing plaintiffs. “We know that the problems exist outside of the physical walls of Dublin, and the same things are happening at other BOP facilities.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Attorneys for both sides discussed possible settlement solutions for the lawsuit on Tuesday; however, an offer still needs to be made.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We are seeking real, lasting changes in the BOP system, including medical and mental health care that’s meaningful, so we don’t plan to settle until we have these changes,” Montes said in a press conference shortly following the hearing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Allegations of sexual abuse at FCI Dublin date back decades, including a major settlement case plaintiffs won in the 1990s. The most recent series of scandals first started unraveling following an investigation by The Associated Press in 2021. It revealed a culture of abuse and cover-ups that had persisted for years at the low-security federal women’s prison, which had more than 650 inmates before shuttering.\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"postid":"news_11980960","hero":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/GettyImages-1181905632-1020x680.jpg","label":""},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Eight former FCI Dublin correctional officers, including the former warden and chaplain, have been convicted and charged and seven have been sentenced.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Since 2021, formerly incarcerated at the Federal Correctional Institution, Dublin, have filed nearly 60 lawsuits alleging a range of sexual harassment violations and retaliation by officers. That includes the class action lawsuit, which started public proceedings on Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Earlier this year, U.S. District Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11982014/judge-chooses-top-pick-for-special-master-to-oversee-womens-prison-following-rampant-abuse\">ordered a special master\u003c/a> to oversee mandatory changes at the prison following years of sexual assault allegations and criminal charges against eight officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Shortly after, Wendy Still was appointed to the position; however, the Biden administration announced that the facility would shut down.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Women who were housed at the facility have since transferred across the country to a small handful of other women’s prisons. Some women have since alleged mistreatment and retaliation during the relocation process and in their new facilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>According to a recent court order, Still will continue in her position even though the prison has closed. She will report on conditions at the prison before and during the transfer process and monitor how women are doing at the facilities they were transferred to.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We are hearing egregious reports of abuse and neglect, conditions of housing that’s dangerous, overcrowding and understaffing and medical needs that aren’t being addressed,” said Erin Neff, an advocate with California Coalition for Women Prisoners. “I am very encouraged by Gonzalez Rogers’ decision to continue the special master’s role for the 600 individuals who are now across the country.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Gonzalez Rogers responded by calling the \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11985645/closure-of-california-federal-prison-was-poorly-planned-judge-says-ordering-further-monitoring\">closure and transfer process “ill-conceived”\u003c/a> and ordered close monitoring and care of women at their new facilities.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People are vulnerable to retaliation. People still face unconstitutional conditions of confinement, a lack of medical care and so much more,” Montes said. “This is clear; this is a result of not just individual officers who are committing abuses, but it’s an issue of BOP-wide policies that have continued to allow people to suffer.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11987292/trial-for-class-action-lawsuit-over-troubled-womens-prison-slated-for-june-2025","authors":["11840"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8"],"tags":["news_18538","news_30069","news_17725","news_33723","news_27626","news_19954","news_21891","news_4435","news_2700","news_1527","news_32043"],"featImg":"news_11987297","label":"news"},"news_11987051":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11987051","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11987051","score":null,"sort":[1716285653000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"bonus-the-fifth-estate-s2-new-folsom","title":"BONUS: The Whistleblower Playbook | S2: New Folsom","publishDate":1716285653,"format":"audio","headTitle":"BONUS: The Whistleblower Playbook | S2: New Folsom | KQED","labelTerm":{"term":33521,"site":"news"},"content":"\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Sukey sits down with Mary Inman and Poppy Alexander, two whistleblower attorneys who talk about the cost of speaking up, and unpack the playbook that employers use to keep people quiet. They also discuss a shift in thinking that can protect both whistleblowers and their organizations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC4625892902\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mental health resources\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">If you are currently in crisis, you can dial 988 [U.S.] to reach the National Suicide and Crisis Lifeline.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.samhsa.gov/find-help/national-helpline\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">SAMHSA National Help Line\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://988lifeline.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nami.org/help\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) Helpline\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.hhs.gov/programs/prevention-and-wellness/mental-health-substance-abuse/index.html\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">US Health and Human Services\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://warmline.org/warmdir.html\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Warmline Directory\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Whistleblower resources\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblower.law/\">Whistleblower Partners, LLP\u003c/a> (where Mary and Poppy are partners)\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://www.thelamplighterproject.org\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The Lamplighter Project\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://thesignalsnetwork.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The Signals Network\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://empowr.us/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">EMPOWR\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblowersofamerica.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Whistleblowers of America\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://whistleblower.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Government Accountability Project\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblowers.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">National Whistleblower Center\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://whistlebloweraid.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Whistleblower Aid\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Mary Inman was profiled in the New Yorker piece, \u003ca href=\"https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/02/04/the-personal-toll-of-whistle-blowing\">“The Personal Toll of Whistleblowing.”\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"https://journalism.berkeley.edu/programs/mj/investigative-reporting/\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Investigative Reporting Program\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> at UC Berkeley’s Graduate School of Journalism was a key partner in making Season 2 of On Our Watch.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The records obtained for this project are part of the\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"https://projects.scpr.org/california-reporting-project/\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> California Reporting Project\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">, a coalition of news organizations in California. If you have tips or feedback about this series please reach out to us at \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"mailto:onourwatch@kqed.org\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">onourwatch@kqed.org\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">. \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Chris Egusa: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Before we start, I just wanted to give you a heads up that this episode references suicide. If you or someone you know needs support, we’ve got links to resources in the episode description. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Hi, listeners, it’s Sukey. We’re back. Over the next few weeks, we’re going to be bringing you some brand new bonus episodes. We’re going to dip into some of the stories that didn’t make it in the podcast, and talk to some experts to help us understand Correctional Officer Valentino Rodriguez and Sergeant Kevin Steele in a broader light. We’re starting off this week with a really interesting conversation about what it means to be a whistleblower. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">When my colleague Julie first spoke to Val Senior about his son and his friend, Sergeant Kevin Steele, he was hesitant to call them whistleblowers. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Valentino Rodriguez, Sr.: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That name doesn’t do justice to people that have come forward, for me. When we were kids, being a whistleblower is tattletale. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Julie Small: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Oh, see I think of it as heroic. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The term and its many fraught interpretations are woven throughout our story. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Dion Green: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">But I’m a whistleblower rat for ex- exposing this ongoing corruption of staff and that I need to be taken out. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sgt. Kevin Steele: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">It can take on a bad connotation sometimes, but it is, again, a government program intended to expose corruption. That’s what it’s designed for. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Tinkerbell: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I still haven’t been confirmed with whistleblower status, so that’s another reason why I’m a little still… I mean, I would venture to say that hopefully, the legal system would protect me. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And so we wanted to spend some time talking to two people who can help us understand this term and the challenges of coming forward. Thank you both so much for coming in. Could we just start off by having you each introduce yourselves? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Sure. My name’s Mary Inman. I’m a partner at the law firm Whistleblower Partners, and I’m in the San Francisco office, and we specialize in representing whistleblowers under the various U.S. whistleblower reward programs. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I am Poppy Alexander. I am Mary’s partner here at Whistleblower Partners in the San Francisco office. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">We wanted to talk to Mary and Poppy to better understand the journey that Officer Valentino Rodriguez and Sergeant Kevin Steele went through to become whistleblowers, and to see if they had any solutions for how to better support people like them in the future. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So, yeah, these were two correctional officers. Well, one was a correctional officer, the other was a correctional sergeant, who both took it upon themselves to report the misconduct of their fellow officers, which is, you know, a very difficult thing to do. And, you know, had pretty serious consequences because of it. And I was just wondering, Mary, if you can put their stories in a broader context, you know, how common are experiences like theirs, among whistleblowers that you speak to or that you have, you know, studied? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. Unfortunately, the experiences that both Valentino and Sergeant Steele had are incredibly common. There seems to be a playbook that organizations — whether they’re private or public — have when someone blows the whistle. It’s often people reverting to what I call a ‘medieval mindset,’ where the playbook says we shoot the messenger to divert attention from the message. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So that certainly seems very much to be the case that happened here. But it happens regardless of industry or sector. Poppy and I have represented whistleblowers in the tech sector, in health care, in transportation, in finance, and it’s very similar. When you would hope that what a whistleblower does is just shine a light on a fraud for people to look at it or wrongdoing for people to examine it is incredibly demoralizing to a whistleblower that the spotlight gets moved away from that and shown solidly on them. And that can be incredibly disorienting and incredibly demoralizing. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Mary is absolutely right. We see this all the time in every industry. But I do think that there’s something special about the prison context here. We’re talking about folks who are literally locked up, whether you are a guard or you’re a prisoner, you’re in the same space. You’re sort of stuck together. That is inevitably going to lead to a different mentality that is very much about, you know, circling up, guarding the wagons. That is more extreme even than what we see in sort of the normal context as well. There is a real incentive in these kinds of spaces to guard the institution, to shoot the messenger, to keep the doors closed. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">There’s all these perceptions from very- when we’re a very young age that, you know, you don’t rat out or you don’t tattle. That is just magnified a thousand fold when you enter the scenario of military or security or in this case, prison guards. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. And peace officers as well, kind of have, you know, a unique bind or perhaps a unique bind, which is that they’re often both required by policy to report misconduct and not insulated from retaliation if they do so. And if they end up stepping outside the chain of command to report misconduct, you know, to the media, for example, they can get disciplined for sharing confidential information. And I think it also just makes it so difficult for peace officers, in particular, to know what the right thing to do is, you know, they’re they’re bound by all these conflicting rules. And then where does their own moral compass come into things? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I totally agree, and I think, as you were pointing out, Sukey, the the fact that there can be all of these competing obligations that you have… One of the things that can be most difficult is what was present here — is that the wrongdoing that both Valentino and Sergeant Steele were trying to expose went to the very top. And so it can be- it feels like it’s, it’s futile in a way to expose that internally when you’re exposing it to the very chain of command that’s engaged in the wrongdoing. I do understand that, you know, the Office of Internal Affairs is supposed to be, you know, playing a particular ro- role, but it’s incredibly fraught when the fraud has really been designed, and the architects of the fraud are the people who really control your fate. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And as you’re saying, you know, if the whistleblower is exposed internally, that can create incredible psychological and emotional pressures on them. And I think we saw that with both Sergeant Kevin Steele and Valentino Rodriguez, in that kind of isolation and ostracization that they experienced. There are also a number of other officers, you know, who have died by suicide after reporting misconduct and feeling like everyone has turned against them, and I think also that their efforts aren’t aren’t- don’t amount to anything. So that frustration that, ‘I did risk so much, I did put my ass on the line to expose the misconduct. And still there’s nothing being done.’ I know you have, you know, this is an area that’s near and dear to your work, Mary. Can you talk a little bit about the psychosocial impacts of whistleblowing and, you know, these very, very serious, you know, deadly consequences? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I mean, I think we’ve seen this, you’re alluding to, unfortunately, I’ve had the great tragedy of losing two clients in my life. And one of them, The New Yorker did an article talking about the personal toll of whistleblowing. But we’ve also seen it very recently with John Barnett, who’s the whistleblower in the, in the, in the Boeing case, who it appears that he took his life. There’s still, you know, I think some questions about that. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think one of the hardest pieces, and where I think we would all be really well served, is creating a level of psychosocial support, not just for whistleblowers, which I think is vital, but also for the first responders, for the people who deal with whistleblowers — for lawyers like myself. I learned the hard way on having to know more about resources that whistleblowers need. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">One of the best things that anyone can do when they’re first dealing with a whistleblower, whether it’s someone in H.R., or it’s the lawyers who they ultimately come to, or even the media, is to say, ‘I believe you.’ Right? Because that’s the issue, is that they have been in this unreality where, you know, they have been made the problem, and the problem they’re seeking to expose has been swept under the rug. So their whole world has been turned upside down and they’ve lost their support network. So everyone at work now knows that they are, you know, they’re radioactive. ‘Don’t do what you know, Valentino did because it’s not it’s not going to inure to your benefit.’ \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So all of a sudden you’re- you’re isolated. You’ve lost your support network. Then you magnify this by going at home and you’ve lost your job, and your spouse is now or your significant other is incredibly angry, and resentful. So you, you know, the walls do start to feel like they’re closing in. And that’s why I think society we’re at a point — we need whistleblowers so much. They’re often I, I like to say the ‘Fifth Estate.’ They’re they’re a lot of the folks who are actually exposing and holding people to account, but yet we don’t have the even most basic, psycho- psychosocial supports for these people. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And it feels like this kind of vicious cycle as well, too, that, you know, then because you’re under the psychological pressure and you, you know, begin to feel gaslit or what have you or you do take your life, then we see these cases where the employer or the organization can point at them and say, ‘Look, see, we don’t have to believe what they said. They were the ones having trouble. They were the one, you know, they were in mental distress. They were crazy.’ And so discount their reports even after, you know, their deaths. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I mean, first of all, that’s not good logic. And secondly, I hope that the folks, the other folks that that message is directed to, which, of course, is the other employees can recognize how circular that logic is and how self-serving, and how it simply doesn’t reflect the truth. And again, that’s why it’s so important that those whistleblowers who are in a position to do so can be public and can come forward and say, ‘Look: I did this. I survived, and this is what the process looks like.’ No one sets out to be a whistleblower. No one. You know, this is not anyone’s life goal or career aspiration. It happens. You’re forced into it for all sorts of different reasons. And knowing that people have come before and have made it through to the other side is really important. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Totally agree. And I think one of the one of the hardest things for whistleblowers that results in these, very desperate situations in terms of whistleblowers taking their own lives, I think, is that whistleblowers start out not thinking that they’re whistleblowers at all. They’re just trying to expose wrongdoing. And then the world gets turned upside down and the wrongdoing is ignored and the spotlight gets turned on them, that they’re the problem. What makes it so difficult is that I think they have an abiding sense of, ‘There’s an injustice, there’s something wrong, and it hasn’t been addressed. And yet all of this energy, like enormous amounts of energy and resources which could have been used to address the problem, are now being focused on me as the problem.’\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think those are just- it’s so hard to reconcile that. And I think one of the best services that Poppy and I can offer is to describe the playbook to the whistleblower and say, ‘If you talk to me early on, I’m going to spell out for you how this is going to go.’ And then at least it takes some of the sting out of it. And it’s, it’s really quite ironic. Our clients are like, ‘You are completely prescient. Do you have a crystal ball? Like, how did you know this was going to happen?’ And we just said, unfortunately, this is just the path. And so if you know that that’s going to happen and you can try and plan for it, it does help whistleblowers to at least absorb those blows. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I think that, like you’re talking about the psychological journey of the whistleblower. And I think, you know, especially for Sergeant Kevin Steele, he… he really did you kind of see this arc of his, you know, disillusionment with his institution and that the place that he begins in is one of such faith in these, you know, pillars that he believed in and that were of, you know, fairness and accountability. And, you know, he’s just so kind of by the book, dude. And the betrayal that he experienced when he did try to report misconduct and having that not be taken seriously was incredibly crushing to him. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I mean, I think with Sergeant Steele, it’s a particularly acute scenario because in addition to him feeling, you know, having the expectation that all of these policies and, you know, oaths that they took would be taken seriously. And to have the scales fall from your eyes is, you know, it’s a very disillusioning process. But I think what magnified it for him and amplified it, is that he became close with Valentino’s father and he was really traumatized by Valentino’s death, and this question of whether or not this was, you know, a suspicious death. Whether he died under particular circumstances. So I think there was also a level of guilt, because Valentino was on his team and someone that he should protect. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is absolutely the same thing we see. I- we see this day in and day out with whistleblowers in terms of the journeys that they have. And I think that a lot of us have observed this that there’s sort of this culture, at least, at least in the United States, as to whistleblowing that they’re either heroes or villains. And I think a lot of us believe that one of the best things, psychologically, for whistleblowers is if we could normalize it. They don’t want to be either. And I think that that is probably one of the things that they get caught up in \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> is in this, in this sort of dilemma. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">We saw with the MeToo movement that a lot of this is- the psychological journey can also involve gaslighting and starting to doubt yourself. I think that’s what we see with Sergeant Steele is that he believed all of these things to be true. And then his reality started to change. And then that really makes you start to doubt yourself. And, and the circling the wagons phenomenon that Poppy talked about just makes this worse, is that everybody else is trying to suggest that this is not how it happened. And you start to then that makes even more self-doubt, which can be a very vicious cycle. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">It’s interesting. There’s some studies that talk a lot about what happens to whistleblowers. Because of the pressures they lose their friends, they lose their social network. And so the New England Journal of Medicine did a study on pharmaceutical whistleblowers who expose the pharmaceutical industry. You know, they’re seeing higher incidences of divorce, of depression, anxiety, substance abuse. I think these are all outward indicators of tools that- and the occasion of what happens when, you know, you expose something and then, instead of it being corrected, it gets covered up. And then you yourself, as the whistleblower, often become persona non grata. The retaliation is done by your employer as a way to send a signal to other whistleblowers, ‘You shouldn’t do this.’ So your sort of almost made, basically made an example of. So I think all of these are, you know, is an environment that’s just incredibly difficult. And it adds insult to injury. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">You mentioned the MeToo movement, and I think one of the things that we have found in our reporting as well, is how, you know, discrimination, misogyny, racism also become tools to enforce the code of silence and to keep people from speaking up. I mean, I know as a woman, that feeling of like, oh, I’ve got to be cool to get along. You know, I’m not going to like, rock the boat or push back if somebody makes an inappropriate comment — you know, taken to a much more serious level, obviously, with Valentino Rodriguez. But does that translate to other contexts outside the prison as well? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. Unfortunately, we see this a lot. It is rarer than any of us would like to see female whistleblowers, to see whistleblowers of color. And so much of that has to do with that mentality you just mentioned. That, you know, ‘we’re trained to get along,’ and we’re trained that ‘to get along’ means to value the traditional workplace culture of white cis men. And that obviously is amplified in the prison context. But that’s true everywhere. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I- this is my completely uneducated guess, but I do feel like we’re starting to see a shift there. And certainly starting to see more female whistleblowers just coming in the door. And I do wonder how much of that is the MeToo movement. I wonder how much of that is people just being fed up with that attitude. But it still is very much a problem. And, you know, as Mary said, we have this tradition of we either see whistleblowers as heroes or villains, but either way, it’s oftentimes this sort of mentality of, you know, the single man standing alone on the hilltop shouting, you know, shouting the truth. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And that’s not true. Women have been whistleblowers forever. People of color have been whistleblowers forever. They have found other ways to make sure that that information gets out. You know, some have been very public about it. Erin Brockovich is, you know, maybe the quintessential example on some level. But, and other people do it in different ways. They help their community. They make sure that the information gets out via a whisper network, what have you. There’s all sorts of strategies to make sure that the truth gets told. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">But when it comes to this sort of ‘in-group outgroup mentality’ of making sure that you were sort of getting along in a confined space, whether that’s a workplace, whether that’s a prison, whether that’s whatever it might be, there certainly are added incentives to put your head down, do your work, ignore what is oftentimes right in front of your face as a wrong. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, I agree, the power differential is something that is really significant, right? In terms of you see, a lot of studies have shown that women and people of color are more likely to leave an organization than to report. And I do think that MeToo started to show us a way that, if we can create a solidarity among whistleblowers, I think that’s one of the strongest way we can encourage, reporting. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I would love to see us have more avenues to find ways to bring whistleblowers together. So it isn’t, just that lone wolf as Poppy said. But that there are multiple people linking arms, saying that this happened to them as well. And then you really do have to pay, give it more credence than if it’s just one sole person. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Ad break]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think within, you know, the California Department of Corrections and going back to the policy of their, you know, ban on the code of silence, there’s been an unintended consequence, at least according — or maybe it’s intended, I don’t know — but at least according to the correctional officers that we spoke to, which is that if you don’t report right away, you can then get in trouble when you report later. Like, if you see an incident happen, excessive use of force, maybe you’re fearful to come forward initially, and then you- you gather that internal fortitude and you decide to make that report, you can often then get disciplined for, you know, holding to the code of silence thus far. And it creates a disincentive to come forward rather than, you know, the stated purpose of this policy, which is to create an incentive to come forward. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That’s such a challenge. You know, we have clients who come forward sometimes and tell us about information that’s many, many years old. And there’s lots of reasons why they might suddenly wake up one day and say, ‘Now’s the time. I have to tell someone.’ Of course, it’s probably better in terms of trying to solve problems, when people come to us with fresh information, we can usually do more with it. But that doesn’t mean that that’s a less valid whistleblower simply because they waited. It usually means that there’s something else going on in their lives that prevented them from coming forward first. And we need to recognize that in how we design our policies and how we think through this. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, we’ve heard from a number of correctional officers since the podcast came out saying that just hearing these stories made them feel like, you know, they might have an opportunity to speak up. \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> And that’s, you know, really heartening, obviously, in terms of just the rewarding work of getting these voices out into the world. But I’ve also talked to correctional officers who have, you know, tried to get whistleblower protections, and often they want to do it before they blow the whistle. They want to know, like, ‘Oh, I’m going to be protected ahead of time. Like, where do I go to, you know, get my whistleblower card or whatever.’ \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> And, you know, from my understanding, it really doesn’t work like that. Like it’s very based on, you know, retroactive retaliation. And if you can prove that you were retaliated against, maybe you can get some retroactive protection. But can either of you address that issue? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think there really, it can be very difficult to prove retaliation. Sort of the statistics of the ability of someone to succeed in a retaliation claim in the United States are very dire. \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> They’re not great. And I think part of that is because it’s very difficult to prove that you were retaliated against for speaking up as compared to some- any other reason that someone can pretextual come up with, right? Like, oh, you’re chronically late, even though your chronic lateness was something that everyone tolerated for years. But until you spoke up, then all of a sudden that becomes a problem. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Is there something that needs to change in the law to make that an easier argument to make, or to, you know, the lower the standard of proof that you have to reach in order to prove that retaliation happened? What are some fixes that you see for that? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Well, it’s interesting, in Europe there’s now something called the European Whistleblowing Directive. And one of the changes that they made that I would love to see being made across all of the various retaliation protections laws, is this burden- shifting the burden of proof. That the burden initially, and for too long, remains on the plaintiff. To have to prove that, you know, they were retaliated against because they spoke up. And if we can reverse- shift that burden of proof and put it on the employer, actually, to prove that, you know, they did do it for a legitimate reason, I think that would be one concrete way that we could improve the odds that people could succeed. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think the, you know, looking domestically, I think the SEC also provides a really excellent model here where the SEC takes very seriously any accusations of retaliation related to someone who has reported securities fraud to the, to the agency. And they take it very seriously and they, you know, will tell employers at every opportunity that they take it very seriously. And that public messaging has been extremely important and protective. And then oftentimes it then puts whistleblowers in the somewhat uncomfortable position of having to decide where they’re going to publicly declare to the company that they, in fact, did report to the SEC, because then that does provide them some level of protection. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That only applies to some small subset of the whistle blowing world. But there’s no reason that has to be true. There’s lots of other ways to try to build off of that same level of protection that we see. There’s other agencies that are involved and whistle-blowing in all sorts of forms, we have- you know, OSHA is involved in many of these cases. There’s- we have lots of agencies here. So I think there’s lots of other strategies to try to build in more of a protection. But it does. It always starts with culture. Right? And that’s culture both from the government side of telling companies and telling organizations what’s important. And then of course, it starts on the company side. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I think the- the long tail of fear that correctional officers experience after- even after they leave… Like, they’ve retired for years, but they’re still afraid to speak up. They don’t know if their pension can be taken away. They don’t know what power the institution still has over them. There’s also, you know, obviously just their their friendship groups and their culture that they’re afraid of losing. But there’s just this very long tail of oppression, I would say, that they experience psychologically and that it’s not entirely dissipated when they leave the prison at all. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. And you know, so, so many times prisons, right, are and very small towns. And so even if you’re not working at the prison, you’re still- most other people in the town are going to be. And that then means there’s really no way to sort of escape that. But of course, you shouldn’t have to. You shouldn’t have to lose all your friends and community simply because you’re willing to take a stand and tell the truth. That should never be a consequence of telling the truth. And- but of course it acts as a disincentive for coming forward, for speaking out against the pack, for what have you, which can only be remedied by changing the culture, can only be remedied by encouraging people to see that as a good. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And Sukey, you’re right that the retaliation doesn’t stop when they leave the prison. And there’s sort of a long tail of retaliation, right? Which is often when you go to that next job, unfortunately that next employer will often call for a recommendation or a reference to your existing employer. And, we often see that even if they’re not doing it directly, there’s word of mouth that, ‘You don’t want this person. This is, this person is disloyal. They, you know, they’ve exposed us and created all this difficulty. They’re a troublemaker and you shouldn’t hire them.’ \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And so that certainly, you know, in the case of my whistleblower client that was featured in \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The New Yorker\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">, that was really ultimately his undoing, right? Is that he ended up, because he couldn’t leave the, the part of Florida where he was practicing. He would get interviews and get to a certain place, and then in, in getting his next job position. And when it got to that reference point and they’d say like, ‘Oh, he seems great.’ And you get all these signals. And then all of a sudden when it came to closing the deal, they would never hire him. So that ends up in you draining your 401K, you now don’t have, you know, you’re no longer gainfully employed, and now you’re blocklisted or blacklisted. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think that is one of the other problems that just makes it, again, incredibly insidious that… I always talk about there’s this ‘Scarlet W’ on your chest that’s emblazoned. And that you may want to put it down, you may even want to put down the mantle of whistleblower, but often you’re not allowed to. And that is a cross that you are bearing again and again. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">You know, one of the things that really struck me just doing this reporting is the disconnect between the formal institutional stance, which says, you know, ‘The code of silence is banned. And we want, you know, we take all reports of employee misconduct very seriously, and we want people to come forward.’ And then that what actually happens in response to that. And I’m just wondering if either of you can speak to… is there a policy change that can fix this? Or because there is this disconnect already between policy and action, you know, do we need a different intervention? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is a cultural problem much more than a policy problem. Though the policies obviously are then tied together because if you know that the company’s policy is that they’re going to, you know, they’re going to take every whistleblower complaint with this huge grain of salt, they’re not going to start from the presumption that the whistleblower is correct. They’re not going to start from the presumption, which is usually true, that the whistleblower is reporting this because they love the company or the organization or, you know, the group. They’re doing it out of love. They’re doing it because they want it to be better. They’ve, you know, they found a problem and they want to fix the problem, and they want to do it before someone from the outside finds out about the problem. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That so often is what the energy is that our clients bring when they’re coming forward. And what they’re met with is this culture of silence there. You know, you talk into a black box, you never hear what happens again. All too often, our clients say to us that we are the first person to ever listen to them about what they’re talking about. And that’s sad because we are never someone’s first call. We really aren’t. They’re always trying to get some change to happen before they resort to calling a whistleblower attorney — as as they should be, quite honestly. And if smart organizations and smart companies would just listen to their whistleblowers, they would put us out of a job. But that’s good. That would be better for everybody. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I agree, and there’s some really great empirical data and research coming out of George Washington University and the University of Utah that really reinforces this idea that whistleblowers are actually your best risk management tool. They’re the canaries in the coal mine that actually help you see a problem before we’re all overtaken by noxious fumes. And this research really basically underscores that companies that actually see whistleblowers in this way as, as, you know, people who can help mitigate risks and deal with problems before they metastasize into something like a big public relations scandal… If you use them in this way, it actually allows companies to be more profitable. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think one of the biggest things that needs to happen is just an education on who whistleblowers really are. As Poppy said, whistleblowers are- not only are they not disloyal, they are your \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">most\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> loyal employees because it takes a lot of intestinal fortitude to be the type of employee who is going to tell you the hard truths at considerable potential risk to themselves. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Thank you for coming into the studio and just lending your expertise and your empathy to this conversation. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, it’s been a real pleasure to be on this podcast. It’s a real testament that the only way we’re going to get change is, is to, you know, point to really great investigative journalists like this. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. It’s, it’s a horrible topic, but it brings great joy to talk about it because it’s so important and so misunderstood, quite honestly, I think, so much about the process of whistleblowing. And so every opportunity to be able to talk about it and really go in depth as you are in this podcast series is just invaluable. And it’s invaluable for the future whistleblowers, for the next person who finds themself in an uncomfortable situation where they really need to speak up and they don’t know what it means and they don’t know how. You know, the education of learning what that process looks like is something we all need to work on. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Again, that was Poppy Alexander and Mary Inman. They are also working right now with federal legislators to try and introduce a bill that would provide mental health support for whistleblowers. We have a link to Mary and Poppy’s website in our episode description, along with other resources for whistleblowers. Please continue to send tips or feedback about the series to On Our Watch at K-Q-E-D dot O-R-G. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This episode was hosted by me, Sukey Lewis. It was edited by Jen Chien, who is also KQED’s Director of Podcasts. It was produced, scored, and cut by Chris Egusa. Final mixing by Christopher Beale. Original music by Ramtin Arablouei, including our theme song. Additional music from APM Music and Audio Network. Funding for On Our Watch is provided in part by Arnold Ventures and the California Endowment. Thank you to Katie Sprenger, our Podcast Operations Manager, our Managing Editor of News and Enterprise, Otis, R. Taylor, Jr., Ethan Toven-Lindsay, our Vice President of News, and KQED Chief Content Officer Holly Kernan. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And thanks to all of you for listening. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":null,"status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1716311134,"stats":{"hasAudio":true,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":83,"wordCount":6562},"headData":{"title":"BONUS: The Whistleblower Playbook | S2: New Folsom | KQED","description":"Sukey Lewis sits down with Mary Inman and Poppy Alexander, two whistleblower attorneys who talk about the cost of speaking up, and unpack the playbook that employers use to keep people quiet. They also discuss a shift in thinking that can protect both whistleblowers and their organizations.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","socialDescription":"Sukey Lewis sits down with Mary Inman and Poppy Alexander, two whistleblower attorneys who talk about the cost of speaking up, and unpack the playbook that employers use to keep people quiet. They also discuss a shift in thinking that can protect both whistleblowers and their organizations.","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"BONUS: The Whistleblower Playbook | S2: New Folsom","datePublished":"2024-05-21T03:00:53-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-21T10:05:34-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"audioUrl":"https://chrt.fm/track/G6C7C3/traffic.megaphone.fm/KQINC4625892902.mp3?updated=1716251553","sticky":false,"nprStoryId":"kqed-11987051","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11987051/bonus-the-fifth-estate-s2-new-folsom","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"#episode-transcript\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">View the full episode transcript.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Sukey sits down with Mary Inman and Poppy Alexander, two whistleblower attorneys who talk about the cost of speaking up, and unpack the playbook that employers use to keep people quiet. They also discuss a shift in thinking that can protect both whistleblowers and their organizations.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c!-- iframe plugin v.4.3 wordpress.org/plugins/iframe/ -->\u003cbr>\n\u003ciframe loading=\"lazy\" frameborder=\"0\" height=\"200\" scrolling=\"no\" src=\"https://playlist.megaphone.fm/?e=KQINC4625892902\" width=\"100%\" class=\"iframe-class\">\u003c/iframe>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mental health resources\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">If you are currently in crisis, you can dial 988 [U.S.] to reach the National Suicide and Crisis Lifeline.\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.samhsa.gov/find-help/national-helpline\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">SAMHSA National Help Line\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://988lifeline.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.nami.org/help\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">NAMI (National Alliance on Mental Illness) Helpline\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.hhs.gov/programs/prevention-and-wellness/mental-health-substance-abuse/index.html\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">US Health and Human Services\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://warmline.org/warmdir.html\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Warmline Directory\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Whistleblower resources\u003c/b>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblower.law/\">Whistleblower Partners, LLP\u003c/a> (where Mary and Poppy are partners)\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"http://www.thelamplighterproject.org\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The Lamplighter Project\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://thesignalsnetwork.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The Signals Network\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://empowr.us/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">EMPOWR\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblowersofamerica.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Whistleblowers of America\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://whistleblower.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Government Accountability Project\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://www.whistleblowers.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">National Whistleblower Center\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003cbr>\n\u003ca href=\"https://whistlebloweraid.org/\">\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Whistleblower Aid\u003c/span>\u003c/a>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>Mary Inman was profiled in the New Yorker piece, \u003ca href=\"https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/02/04/the-personal-toll-of-whistle-blowing\">“The Personal Toll of Whistleblowing.”\u003c/a>\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"https://journalism.berkeley.edu/programs/mj/investigative-reporting/\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Investigative Reporting Program\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> at UC Berkeley’s Graduate School of Journalism was a key partner in making Season 2 of On Our Watch.\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The records obtained for this project are part of the\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"https://projects.scpr.org/california-reporting-project/\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> California Reporting Project\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">, a coalition of news organizations in California. If you have tips or feedback about this series please reach out to us at \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003ca href=\"mailto:onourwatch@kqed.org\">\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">onourwatch@kqed.org\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/a>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">. \u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp> \u003c/p>\n\u003ch2 id=\"episode-transcript\">Episode Transcript\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This is a computer-generated transcript. While our team has reviewed it, there may be errors.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Chris Egusa: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Before we start, I just wanted to give you a heads up that this episode references suicide. If you or someone you know needs support, we’ve got links to resources in the episode description. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Hi, listeners, it’s Sukey. We’re back. Over the next few weeks, we’re going to be bringing you some brand new bonus episodes. We’re going to dip into some of the stories that didn’t make it in the podcast, and talk to some experts to help us understand Correctional Officer Valentino Rodriguez and Sergeant Kevin Steele in a broader light. We’re starting off this week with a really interesting conversation about what it means to be a whistleblower. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">When my colleague Julie first spoke to Val Senior about his son and his friend, Sergeant Kevin Steele, he was hesitant to call them whistleblowers. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Valentino Rodriguez, Sr.: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That name doesn’t do justice to people that have come forward, for me. When we were kids, being a whistleblower is tattletale. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Julie Small: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Oh, see I think of it as heroic. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The term and its many fraught interpretations are woven throughout our story. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Dion Green: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">But I’m a whistleblower rat for ex- exposing this ongoing corruption of staff and that I need to be taken out. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sgt. Kevin Steele: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">It can take on a bad connotation sometimes, but it is, again, a government program intended to expose corruption. That’s what it’s designed for. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Tinkerbell: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I still haven’t been confirmed with whistleblower status, so that’s another reason why I’m a little still… I mean, I would venture to say that hopefully, the legal system would protect me. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And so we wanted to spend some time talking to two people who can help us understand this term and the challenges of coming forward. Thank you both so much for coming in. Could we just start off by having you each introduce yourselves? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Sure. My name’s Mary Inman. I’m a partner at the law firm Whistleblower Partners, and I’m in the San Francisco office, and we specialize in representing whistleblowers under the various U.S. whistleblower reward programs. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I am Poppy Alexander. I am Mary’s partner here at Whistleblower Partners in the San Francisco office. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">We wanted to talk to Mary and Poppy to better understand the journey that Officer Valentino Rodriguez and Sergeant Kevin Steele went through to become whistleblowers, and to see if they had any solutions for how to better support people like them in the future. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So, yeah, these were two correctional officers. Well, one was a correctional officer, the other was a correctional sergeant, who both took it upon themselves to report the misconduct of their fellow officers, which is, you know, a very difficult thing to do. And, you know, had pretty serious consequences because of it. And I was just wondering, Mary, if you can put their stories in a broader context, you know, how common are experiences like theirs, among whistleblowers that you speak to or that you have, you know, studied? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. Unfortunately, the experiences that both Valentino and Sergeant Steele had are incredibly common. There seems to be a playbook that organizations — whether they’re private or public — have when someone blows the whistle. It’s often people reverting to what I call a ‘medieval mindset,’ where the playbook says we shoot the messenger to divert attention from the message. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So that certainly seems very much to be the case that happened here. But it happens regardless of industry or sector. Poppy and I have represented whistleblowers in the tech sector, in health care, in transportation, in finance, and it’s very similar. When you would hope that what a whistleblower does is just shine a light on a fraud for people to look at it or wrongdoing for people to examine it is incredibly demoralizing to a whistleblower that the spotlight gets moved away from that and shown solidly on them. And that can be incredibly disorienting and incredibly demoralizing. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Mary is absolutely right. We see this all the time in every industry. But I do think that there’s something special about the prison context here. We’re talking about folks who are literally locked up, whether you are a guard or you’re a prisoner, you’re in the same space. You’re sort of stuck together. That is inevitably going to lead to a different mentality that is very much about, you know, circling up, guarding the wagons. That is more extreme even than what we see in sort of the normal context as well. There is a real incentive in these kinds of spaces to guard the institution, to shoot the messenger, to keep the doors closed. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">There’s all these perceptions from very- when we’re a very young age that, you know, you don’t rat out or you don’t tattle. That is just magnified a thousand fold when you enter the scenario of military or security or in this case, prison guards. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. And peace officers as well, kind of have, you know, a unique bind or perhaps a unique bind, which is that they’re often both required by policy to report misconduct and not insulated from retaliation if they do so. And if they end up stepping outside the chain of command to report misconduct, you know, to the media, for example, they can get disciplined for sharing confidential information. And I think it also just makes it so difficult for peace officers, in particular, to know what the right thing to do is, you know, they’re they’re bound by all these conflicting rules. And then where does their own moral compass come into things? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I totally agree, and I think, as you were pointing out, Sukey, the the fact that there can be all of these competing obligations that you have… One of the things that can be most difficult is what was present here — is that the wrongdoing that both Valentino and Sergeant Steele were trying to expose went to the very top. And so it can be- it feels like it’s, it’s futile in a way to expose that internally when you’re exposing it to the very chain of command that’s engaged in the wrongdoing. I do understand that, you know, the Office of Internal Affairs is supposed to be, you know, playing a particular ro- role, but it’s incredibly fraught when the fraud has really been designed, and the architects of the fraud are the people who really control your fate. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And as you’re saying, you know, if the whistleblower is exposed internally, that can create incredible psychological and emotional pressures on them. And I think we saw that with both Sergeant Kevin Steele and Valentino Rodriguez, in that kind of isolation and ostracization that they experienced. There are also a number of other officers, you know, who have died by suicide after reporting misconduct and feeling like everyone has turned against them, and I think also that their efforts aren’t aren’t- don’t amount to anything. So that frustration that, ‘I did risk so much, I did put my ass on the line to expose the misconduct. And still there’s nothing being done.’ I know you have, you know, this is an area that’s near and dear to your work, Mary. Can you talk a little bit about the psychosocial impacts of whistleblowing and, you know, these very, very serious, you know, deadly consequences? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I mean, I think we’ve seen this, you’re alluding to, unfortunately, I’ve had the great tragedy of losing two clients in my life. And one of them, The New Yorker did an article talking about the personal toll of whistleblowing. But we’ve also seen it very recently with John Barnett, who’s the whistleblower in the, in the, in the Boeing case, who it appears that he took his life. There’s still, you know, I think some questions about that. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think one of the hardest pieces, and where I think we would all be really well served, is creating a level of psychosocial support, not just for whistleblowers, which I think is vital, but also for the first responders, for the people who deal with whistleblowers — for lawyers like myself. I learned the hard way on having to know more about resources that whistleblowers need. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">One of the best things that anyone can do when they’re first dealing with a whistleblower, whether it’s someone in H.R., or it’s the lawyers who they ultimately come to, or even the media, is to say, ‘I believe you.’ Right? Because that’s the issue, is that they have been in this unreality where, you know, they have been made the problem, and the problem they’re seeking to expose has been swept under the rug. So their whole world has been turned upside down and they’ve lost their support network. So everyone at work now knows that they are, you know, they’re radioactive. ‘Don’t do what you know, Valentino did because it’s not it’s not going to inure to your benefit.’ \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So all of a sudden you’re- you’re isolated. You’ve lost your support network. Then you magnify this by going at home and you’ve lost your job, and your spouse is now or your significant other is incredibly angry, and resentful. So you, you know, the walls do start to feel like they’re closing in. And that’s why I think society we’re at a point — we need whistleblowers so much. They’re often I, I like to say the ‘Fifth Estate.’ They’re they’re a lot of the folks who are actually exposing and holding people to account, but yet we don’t have the even most basic, psycho- psychosocial supports for these people. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And it feels like this kind of vicious cycle as well, too, that, you know, then because you’re under the psychological pressure and you, you know, begin to feel gaslit or what have you or you do take your life, then we see these cases where the employer or the organization can point at them and say, ‘Look, see, we don’t have to believe what they said. They were the ones having trouble. They were the one, you know, they were in mental distress. They were crazy.’ And so discount their reports even after, you know, their deaths. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I mean, first of all, that’s not good logic. And secondly, I hope that the folks, the other folks that that message is directed to, which, of course, is the other employees can recognize how circular that logic is and how self-serving, and how it simply doesn’t reflect the truth. And again, that’s why it’s so important that those whistleblowers who are in a position to do so can be public and can come forward and say, ‘Look: I did this. I survived, and this is what the process looks like.’ No one sets out to be a whistleblower. No one. You know, this is not anyone’s life goal or career aspiration. It happens. You’re forced into it for all sorts of different reasons. And knowing that people have come before and have made it through to the other side is really important. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Totally agree. And I think one of the one of the hardest things for whistleblowers that results in these, very desperate situations in terms of whistleblowers taking their own lives, I think, is that whistleblowers start out not thinking that they’re whistleblowers at all. They’re just trying to expose wrongdoing. And then the world gets turned upside down and the wrongdoing is ignored and the spotlight gets turned on them, that they’re the problem. What makes it so difficult is that I think they have an abiding sense of, ‘There’s an injustice, there’s something wrong, and it hasn’t been addressed. And yet all of this energy, like enormous amounts of energy and resources which could have been used to address the problem, are now being focused on me as the problem.’\u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think those are just- it’s so hard to reconcile that. And I think one of the best services that Poppy and I can offer is to describe the playbook to the whistleblower and say, ‘If you talk to me early on, I’m going to spell out for you how this is going to go.’ And then at least it takes some of the sting out of it. And it’s, it’s really quite ironic. Our clients are like, ‘You are completely prescient. Do you have a crystal ball? Like, how did you know this was going to happen?’ And we just said, unfortunately, this is just the path. And so if you know that that’s going to happen and you can try and plan for it, it does help whistleblowers to at least absorb those blows. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I think that, like you’re talking about the psychological journey of the whistleblower. And I think, you know, especially for Sergeant Kevin Steele, he… he really did you kind of see this arc of his, you know, disillusionment with his institution and that the place that he begins in is one of such faith in these, you know, pillars that he believed in and that were of, you know, fairness and accountability. And, you know, he’s just so kind of by the book, dude. And the betrayal that he experienced when he did try to report misconduct and having that not be taken seriously was incredibly crushing to him. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I mean, I think with Sergeant Steele, it’s a particularly acute scenario because in addition to him feeling, you know, having the expectation that all of these policies and, you know, oaths that they took would be taken seriously. And to have the scales fall from your eyes is, you know, it’s a very disillusioning process. But I think what magnified it for him and amplified it, is that he became close with Valentino’s father and he was really traumatized by Valentino’s death, and this question of whether or not this was, you know, a suspicious death. Whether he died under particular circumstances. So I think there was also a level of guilt, because Valentino was on his team and someone that he should protect. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is absolutely the same thing we see. I- we see this day in and day out with whistleblowers in terms of the journeys that they have. And I think that a lot of us have observed this that there’s sort of this culture, at least, at least in the United States, as to whistleblowing that they’re either heroes or villains. And I think a lot of us believe that one of the best things, psychologically, for whistleblowers is if we could normalize it. They don’t want to be either. And I think that that is probably one of the things that they get caught up in \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> is in this, in this sort of dilemma. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">We saw with the MeToo movement that a lot of this is- the psychological journey can also involve gaslighting and starting to doubt yourself. I think that’s what we see with Sergeant Steele is that he believed all of these things to be true. And then his reality started to change. And then that really makes you start to doubt yourself. And, and the circling the wagons phenomenon that Poppy talked about just makes this worse, is that everybody else is trying to suggest that this is not how it happened. And you start to then that makes even more self-doubt, which can be a very vicious cycle. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">It’s interesting. There’s some studies that talk a lot about what happens to whistleblowers. Because of the pressures they lose their friends, they lose their social network. And so the New England Journal of Medicine did a study on pharmaceutical whistleblowers who expose the pharmaceutical industry. You know, they’re seeing higher incidences of divorce, of depression, anxiety, substance abuse. I think these are all outward indicators of tools that- and the occasion of what happens when, you know, you expose something and then, instead of it being corrected, it gets covered up. And then you yourself, as the whistleblower, often become persona non grata. The retaliation is done by your employer as a way to send a signal to other whistleblowers, ‘You shouldn’t do this.’ So your sort of almost made, basically made an example of. So I think all of these are, you know, is an environment that’s just incredibly difficult. And it adds insult to injury. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">You mentioned the MeToo movement, and I think one of the things that we have found in our reporting as well, is how, you know, discrimination, misogyny, racism also become tools to enforce the code of silence and to keep people from speaking up. I mean, I know as a woman, that feeling of like, oh, I’ve got to be cool to get along. You know, I’m not going to like, rock the boat or push back if somebody makes an inappropriate comment — you know, taken to a much more serious level, obviously, with Valentino Rodriguez. But does that translate to other contexts outside the prison as well? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. Unfortunately, we see this a lot. It is rarer than any of us would like to see female whistleblowers, to see whistleblowers of color. And so much of that has to do with that mentality you just mentioned. That, you know, ‘we’re trained to get along,’ and we’re trained that ‘to get along’ means to value the traditional workplace culture of white cis men. And that obviously is amplified in the prison context. But that’s true everywhere. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I- this is my completely uneducated guess, but I do feel like we’re starting to see a shift there. And certainly starting to see more female whistleblowers just coming in the door. And I do wonder how much of that is the MeToo movement. I wonder how much of that is people just being fed up with that attitude. But it still is very much a problem. And, you know, as Mary said, we have this tradition of we either see whistleblowers as heroes or villains, but either way, it’s oftentimes this sort of mentality of, you know, the single man standing alone on the hilltop shouting, you know, shouting the truth. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And that’s not true. Women have been whistleblowers forever. People of color have been whistleblowers forever. They have found other ways to make sure that that information gets out. You know, some have been very public about it. Erin Brockovich is, you know, maybe the quintessential example on some level. But, and other people do it in different ways. They help their community. They make sure that the information gets out via a whisper network, what have you. There’s all sorts of strategies to make sure that the truth gets told. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">But when it comes to this sort of ‘in-group outgroup mentality’ of making sure that you were sort of getting along in a confined space, whether that’s a workplace, whether that’s a prison, whether that’s whatever it might be, there certainly are added incentives to put your head down, do your work, ignore what is oftentimes right in front of your face as a wrong. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, I agree, the power differential is something that is really significant, right? In terms of you see, a lot of studies have shown that women and people of color are more likely to leave an organization than to report. And I do think that MeToo started to show us a way that, if we can create a solidarity among whistleblowers, I think that’s one of the strongest way we can encourage, reporting. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And I would love to see us have more avenues to find ways to bring whistleblowers together. So it isn’t, just that lone wolf as Poppy said. But that there are multiple people linking arms, saying that this happened to them as well. And then you really do have to pay, give it more credence than if it’s just one sole person. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Ad break]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think within, you know, the California Department of Corrections and going back to the policy of their, you know, ban on the code of silence, there’s been an unintended consequence, at least according — or maybe it’s intended, I don’t know — but at least according to the correctional officers that we spoke to, which is that if you don’t report right away, you can then get in trouble when you report later. Like, if you see an incident happen, excessive use of force, maybe you’re fearful to come forward initially, and then you- you gather that internal fortitude and you decide to make that report, you can often then get disciplined for, you know, holding to the code of silence thus far. And it creates a disincentive to come forward rather than, you know, the stated purpose of this policy, which is to create an incentive to come forward. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That’s such a challenge. You know, we have clients who come forward sometimes and tell us about information that’s many, many years old. And there’s lots of reasons why they might suddenly wake up one day and say, ‘Now’s the time. I have to tell someone.’ Of course, it’s probably better in terms of trying to solve problems, when people come to us with fresh information, we can usually do more with it. But that doesn’t mean that that’s a less valid whistleblower simply because they waited. It usually means that there’s something else going on in their lives that prevented them from coming forward first. And we need to recognize that in how we design our policies and how we think through this. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, we’ve heard from a number of correctional officers since the podcast came out saying that just hearing these stories made them feel like, you know, they might have an opportunity to speak up. \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> And that’s, you know, really heartening, obviously, in terms of just the rewarding work of getting these voices out into the world. But I’ve also talked to correctional officers who have, you know, tried to get whistleblower protections, and often they want to do it before they blow the whistle. They want to know, like, ‘Oh, I’m going to be protected ahead of time. Like, where do I go to, you know, get my whistleblower card or whatever.’ \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> And, you know, from my understanding, it really doesn’t work like that. Like it’s very based on, you know, retroactive retaliation. And if you can prove that you were retaliated against, maybe you can get some retroactive protection. But can either of you address that issue? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think there really, it can be very difficult to prove retaliation. Sort of the statistics of the ability of someone to succeed in a retaliation claim in the United States are very dire. \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Laughs]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> They’re not great. And I think part of that is because it’s very difficult to prove that you were retaliated against for speaking up as compared to some- any other reason that someone can pretextual come up with, right? Like, oh, you’re chronically late, even though your chronic lateness was something that everyone tolerated for years. But until you spoke up, then all of a sudden that becomes a problem. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Is there something that needs to change in the law to make that an easier argument to make, or to, you know, the lower the standard of proof that you have to reach in order to prove that retaliation happened? What are some fixes that you see for that? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Well, it’s interesting, in Europe there’s now something called the European Whistleblowing Directive. And one of the changes that they made that I would love to see being made across all of the various retaliation protections laws, is this burden- shifting the burden of proof. That the burden initially, and for too long, remains on the plaintiff. To have to prove that, you know, they were retaliated against because they spoke up. And if we can reverse- shift that burden of proof and put it on the employer, actually, to prove that, you know, they did do it for a legitimate reason, I think that would be one concrete way that we could improve the odds that people could succeed. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I think the, you know, looking domestically, I think the SEC also provides a really excellent model here where the SEC takes very seriously any accusations of retaliation related to someone who has reported securities fraud to the, to the agency. And they take it very seriously and they, you know, will tell employers at every opportunity that they take it very seriously. And that public messaging has been extremely important and protective. And then oftentimes it then puts whistleblowers in the somewhat uncomfortable position of having to decide where they’re going to publicly declare to the company that they, in fact, did report to the SEC, because then that does provide them some level of protection. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That only applies to some small subset of the whistle blowing world. But there’s no reason that has to be true. There’s lots of other ways to try to build off of that same level of protection that we see. There’s other agencies that are involved and whistle-blowing in all sorts of forms, we have- you know, OSHA is involved in many of these cases. There’s- we have lots of agencies here. So I think there’s lots of other strategies to try to build in more of a protection. But it does. It always starts with culture. Right? And that’s culture both from the government side of telling companies and telling organizations what’s important. And then of course, it starts on the company side. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah. I think the- the long tail of fear that correctional officers experience after- even after they leave… Like, they’ve retired for years, but they’re still afraid to speak up. They don’t know if their pension can be taken away. They don’t know what power the institution still has over them. There’s also, you know, obviously just their their friendship groups and their culture that they’re afraid of losing. But there’s just this very long tail of oppression, I would say, that they experience psychologically and that it’s not entirely dissipated when they leave the prison at all. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. And you know, so, so many times prisons, right, are and very small towns. And so even if you’re not working at the prison, you’re still- most other people in the town are going to be. And that then means there’s really no way to sort of escape that. But of course, you shouldn’t have to. You shouldn’t have to lose all your friends and community simply because you’re willing to take a stand and tell the truth. That should never be a consequence of telling the truth. And- but of course it acts as a disincentive for coming forward, for speaking out against the pack, for what have you, which can only be remedied by changing the culture, can only be remedied by encouraging people to see that as a good. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And Sukey, you’re right that the retaliation doesn’t stop when they leave the prison. And there’s sort of a long tail of retaliation, right? Which is often when you go to that next job, unfortunately that next employer will often call for a recommendation or a reference to your existing employer. And, we often see that even if they’re not doing it directly, there’s word of mouth that, ‘You don’t want this person. This is, this person is disloyal. They, you know, they’ve exposed us and created all this difficulty. They’re a troublemaker and you shouldn’t hire them.’ \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And so that certainly, you know, in the case of my whistleblower client that was featured in \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">The New Yorker\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">, that was really ultimately his undoing, right? Is that he ended up, because he couldn’t leave the, the part of Florida where he was practicing. He would get interviews and get to a certain place, and then in, in getting his next job position. And when it got to that reference point and they’d say like, ‘Oh, he seems great.’ And you get all these signals. And then all of a sudden when it came to closing the deal, they would never hire him. So that ends up in you draining your 401K, you now don’t have, you know, you’re no longer gainfully employed, and now you’re blocklisted or blacklisted. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think that is one of the other problems that just makes it, again, incredibly insidious that… I always talk about there’s this ‘Scarlet W’ on your chest that’s emblazoned. And that you may want to put it down, you may even want to put down the mantle of whistleblower, but often you’re not allowed to. And that is a cross that you are bearing again and again. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">You know, one of the things that really struck me just doing this reporting is the disconnect between the formal institutional stance, which says, you know, ‘The code of silence is banned. And we want, you know, we take all reports of employee misconduct very seriously, and we want people to come forward.’ And then that what actually happens in response to that. And I’m just wondering if either of you can speak to… is there a policy change that can fix this? Or because there is this disconnect already between policy and action, you know, do we need a different intervention? \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This is a cultural problem much more than a policy problem. Though the policies obviously are then tied together because if you know that the company’s policy is that they’re going to, you know, they’re going to take every whistleblower complaint with this huge grain of salt, they’re not going to start from the presumption that the whistleblower is correct. They’re not going to start from the presumption, which is usually true, that the whistleblower is reporting this because they love the company or the organization or, you know, the group. They’re doing it out of love. They’re doing it because they want it to be better. They’ve, you know, they found a problem and they want to fix the problem, and they want to do it before someone from the outside finds out about the problem. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">That so often is what the energy is that our clients bring when they’re coming forward. And what they’re met with is this culture of silence there. You know, you talk into a black box, you never hear what happens again. All too often, our clients say to us that we are the first person to ever listen to them about what they’re talking about. And that’s sad because we are never someone’s first call. We really aren’t. They’re always trying to get some change to happen before they resort to calling a whistleblower attorney — as as they should be, quite honestly. And if smart organizations and smart companies would just listen to their whistleblowers, they would put us out of a job. But that’s good. That would be better for everybody. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">I agree, and there’s some really great empirical data and research coming out of George Washington University and the University of Utah that really reinforces this idea that whistleblowers are actually your best risk management tool. They’re the canaries in the coal mine that actually help you see a problem before we’re all overtaken by noxious fumes. And this research really basically underscores that companies that actually see whistleblowers in this way as, as, you know, people who can help mitigate risks and deal with problems before they metastasize into something like a big public relations scandal… If you use them in this way, it actually allows companies to be more profitable. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">So I think one of the biggest things that needs to happen is just an education on who whistleblowers really are. As Poppy said, whistleblowers are- not only are they not disloyal, they are your \u003c/span>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">most\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\"> loyal employees because it takes a lot of intestinal fortitude to be the type of employee who is going to tell you the hard truths at considerable potential risk to themselves. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Thank you for coming into the studio and just lending your expertise and your empathy to this conversation. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Mary Inman: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Yeah, it’s been a real pleasure to be on this podcast. It’s a real testament that the only way we’re going to get change is, is to, you know, point to really great investigative journalists like this. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Poppy Alexander: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Absolutely. It’s, it’s a horrible topic, but it brings great joy to talk about it because it’s so important and so misunderstood, quite honestly, I think, so much about the process of whistleblowing. And so every opportunity to be able to talk about it and really go in depth as you are in this podcast series is just invaluable. And it’s invaluable for the future whistleblowers, for the next person who finds themself in an uncomfortable situation where they really need to speak up and they don’t know what it means and they don’t know how. You know, the education of learning what that process looks like is something we all need to work on. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ci>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">[Music]\u003c/span>\u003c/i>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>Sukey Lewis: \u003c/b>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">Again, that was Poppy Alexander and Mary Inman. They are also working right now with federal legislators to try and introduce a bill that would provide mental health support for whistleblowers. We have a link to Mary and Poppy’s website in our episode description, along with other resources for whistleblowers. Please continue to send tips or feedback about the series to On Our Watch at K-Q-E-D dot O-R-G. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">This episode was hosted by me, Sukey Lewis. It was edited by Jen Chien, who is also KQED’s Director of Podcasts. It was produced, scored, and cut by Chris Egusa. Final mixing by Christopher Beale. Original music by Ramtin Arablouei, including our theme song. Additional music from APM Music and Audio Network. Funding for On Our Watch is provided in part by Arnold Ventures and the California Endowment. Thank you to Katie Sprenger, our Podcast Operations Manager, our Managing Editor of News and Enterprise, Otis, R. Taylor, Jr., Ethan Toven-Lindsay, our Vice President of News, and KQED Chief Content Officer Holly Kernan. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cspan style=\"font-weight: 400\">And thanks to all of you for listening. \u003c/span>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11987051/bonus-the-fifth-estate-s2-new-folsom","authors":["8676"],"programs":["news_33521"],"categories":["news_31795","news_6188","news_8"],"tags":["news_18538","news_17725","news_29466","news_1471"],"featImg":"news_11987058","label":"news_33521"},"news_11986718":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11986718","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11986718","score":null,"sort":[1715969540000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715969540,"format":"standard","title":"David DePape Sentenced to 30 Years in Federal Prison for Attack on Nancy Pelosi's Husband","headTitle":"David DePape Sentenced to 30 Years in Federal Prison for Attack on Nancy Pelosi’s Husband | KQED","content":"\u003cp>\u003cem>Updated 2:27 p.m. Friday\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The man who was convicted of the attempted kidnapping of former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and of violently assaulting her husband, Paul Pelosi, in the couple’s San Francisco home was sentenced to 30 years in federal prison on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A jury \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967595/david-depape-found-guilty-in-paul-pelosi-hammer-attack\">found David DePape, 44, guilty in November\u003c/a> of one count of attempted kidnapping of a federal officer and one count of assault on the immediate family member of a federal official. The 20- and 30-year sentences he received for each crime were ordered to be served simultaneously.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“This is so harmful to everyone in this country,” U.S. District Court Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley said just before ordering the 30-year sentence, noting that those considering going into public service must now consider the risk not only to themselves but to their spouse, children and grandchildren. “We will never know everything we have lost because of this crime.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In letters to the judge, Nancy and Paul Pelosi described the October 2022 attack’s lasting effects on their lives, physical and otherwise, as they asked for the longest possible sentence. Their daughter, Christine Pelosi, read the letters from the witness stand while DePape looked on.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nancy Pelosi described ongoing security threats and DePape’s resonance with the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Reports of the home invasion with shouts of ‘Where’s Nancy?’ — echoing the January 6th threats — filled me with great fear and deep pain,” she wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape awoke Paul Pelosi with the now-infamous phrase in the early hours of Oct. 28, 2022, looking for his wife.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But she wasn’t home.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Paul Pelosi managed to call 911, and officers arrived at the front door of the Pelosi home to find both men with their hands on a hammer. The body camera video shows officers ordering DePape to drop it. He said, “Nope,” and then struck Pelosi repeatedly on the head, also severely injuring Pelosi’s left hand.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The account was part of significant evidence presented to the federal jury of DePape’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967247/david-depape-on-witness-stand-details-grand-plan-to-violently-interrogate-nancy-pelosi\">plot to kidnap Nancy Pelosi\u003c/a>, among others, and his ultimate assault of Paul Pelosi.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In his letter, Paul Pelosi, who was 82 at the time of the attack, described ongoing pain, sensitivity to bright lights, dizzy spells and nerve damage. He wrote that he can still feel “bumps on my head from the hammer blows and a metal plate from skull surgery.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We do not answer our landline phone or our front door due to ongoing threats,” Paul Pelosi wrote. “We cannot fully remove the stain on the floor in the front entryway where I bled.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nancy Pelosi noted that she and her husband have never talked about what happened during the attack. Without using former President Donald Trump’s name, she appeared to call out times that he has referenced the brutal assault on her husband.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When the attack is a source of sick humor — especially to people in high places — it adds to the pain, the fear and the threat to those who might consider public office,” she wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside label=\"related coverage\" tag=\"david-depape\"]Prosecutors had argued that DePape \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11985847/federal-prosecutors-request-40-year-sentence-for-david-depape-who-attacked-pelosis-husband-with-a-hammer\">should be sentenced to 40 years in prison\u003c/a> because of his violent plot to kidnap the then-speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“This was an \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11986566/prosecutors-push-for-terrorism-enhancement-in-sentencing-of-david-depape-who-bludgeoned-paul-pelosi-in-2022\">act of domestic terrorism\u003c/a>,” a federal prosecutor argued during the sentencing hearing on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She referenced a January 2023 call DePape \u003ca href=\"https://www.ktvu.com/news/depape-in-bizarre-phone-call-to-ktvu-says-he-should-have-been-more-prepared\">made from a jail cell to a KTVU reporter\u003c/a>. “He claimed to be a patriot. He wishes he’d gotten more of them. This is no patriot. This is a domestic terrorist, and it is a lone wolf domestic terrorist.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Judge Corley also referenced DePape’s statement during the call that he was sorry he didn’t “get more of them.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It sounds like he’s taunting his victims,” Corley said from the bench. “He’s taunting America.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The judge said she believes DePape continues to pose a danger to the public. Despite several chances to change course that night in the Pelosi home, he continued with “completely gratuitous” violence, Corley said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Defense attorney Angela Chuang argued that a 14-year sentence was more appropriate.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“DePape was at a very low point in his life” in the months leading up to the attack, she said in court on Friday. “His living situation was bad. He didn’t have bathroom access.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She added that he was spending “every waking hour \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11966865/defense-focuses-on-conspiracy-theories-in-first-day-of-trial-over-attempted-nancy-pelosi-kidnapping\">listening to conspiracy theories\u003c/a> promoted by people in places of power, who command respect” as his mental health deteriorated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape’s federal public defenders filed a notice of appeal Friday afternoon, saying they intend to challenge both the judgment and sentence he received.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape received over a year and a half of credit for his time in custody awaiting trial and sentencing. He faces potential deportation to Canada after his prison sentence, according to statements by the judge and attorneys in court on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape will \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11968645/david-depape-faces-second-trial-for-attempting-to-kidnap-nancy-pelosi-heres-why\">go to trial in state court\u003c/a> in the coming weeks. He is facing multiple state charges, including attempted murder, residential burglary, seriously injuring an elder adult, assault with a deadly weapon, false imprisonment and threatening a public official’s family member. Jury selection is expected to begin Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":940,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":29},"modified":1715983144,"excerpt":"The man who was convicted of the attempted kidnapping of former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and of violently assaulting her husband, Paul Pelosi, was sentenced in federal court on Friday.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"The man who was convicted of the attempted kidnapping of former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and of violently assaulting her husband, Paul Pelosi, was sentenced in federal court on Friday.","title":"David DePape Sentenced to 30 Years in Federal Prison for Attack on Nancy Pelosi's Husband | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"David DePape Sentenced to 30 Years in Federal Prison for Attack on Nancy Pelosi's Husband","datePublished":"2024-05-17T11:12:20-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-17T14:59:04-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"david-depape-sentenced-to-30-years-in-federal-prison-for-attack-on-nancy-pelosis-husband","status":"publish","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"articleAge":"0","nprStoryId":"kqed-11986718","path":"/news/11986718/david-depape-sentenced-to-30-years-in-federal-prison-for-attack-on-nancy-pelosis-husband","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>\u003cem>Updated 2:27 p.m. Friday\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The man who was convicted of the attempted kidnapping of former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and of violently assaulting her husband, Paul Pelosi, in the couple’s San Francisco home was sentenced to 30 years in federal prison on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A jury \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967595/david-depape-found-guilty-in-paul-pelosi-hammer-attack\">found David DePape, 44, guilty in November\u003c/a> of one count of attempted kidnapping of a federal officer and one count of assault on the immediate family member of a federal official. The 20- and 30-year sentences he received for each crime were ordered to be served simultaneously.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“This is so harmful to everyone in this country,” U.S. District Court Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley said just before ordering the 30-year sentence, noting that those considering going into public service must now consider the risk not only to themselves but to their spouse, children and grandchildren. “We will never know everything we have lost because of this crime.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In letters to the judge, Nancy and Paul Pelosi described the October 2022 attack’s lasting effects on their lives, physical and otherwise, as they asked for the longest possible sentence. Their daughter, Christine Pelosi, read the letters from the witness stand while DePape looked on.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nancy Pelosi described ongoing security threats and DePape’s resonance with the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the U.S. Capitol.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Reports of the home invasion with shouts of ‘Where’s Nancy?’ — echoing the January 6th threats — filled me with great fear and deep pain,” she wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape awoke Paul Pelosi with the now-infamous phrase in the early hours of Oct. 28, 2022, looking for his wife.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>But she wasn’t home.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Paul Pelosi managed to call 911, and officers arrived at the front door of the Pelosi home to find both men with their hands on a hammer. The body camera video shows officers ordering DePape to drop it. He said, “Nope,” and then struck Pelosi repeatedly on the head, also severely injuring Pelosi’s left hand.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The account was part of significant evidence presented to the federal jury of DePape’s \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967247/david-depape-on-witness-stand-details-grand-plan-to-violently-interrogate-nancy-pelosi\">plot to kidnap Nancy Pelosi\u003c/a>, among others, and his ultimate assault of Paul Pelosi.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In his letter, Paul Pelosi, who was 82 at the time of the attack, described ongoing pain, sensitivity to bright lights, dizzy spells and nerve damage. He wrote that he can still feel “bumps on my head from the hammer blows and a metal plate from skull surgery.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We do not answer our landline phone or our front door due to ongoing threats,” Paul Pelosi wrote. “We cannot fully remove the stain on the floor in the front entryway where I bled.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nancy Pelosi noted that she and her husband have never talked about what happened during the attack. Without using former President Donald Trump’s name, she appeared to call out times that he has referenced the brutal assault on her husband.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When the attack is a source of sick humor — especially to people in high places — it adds to the pain, the fear and the threat to those who might consider public office,” she wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"label":"related coverage ","tag":"david-depape"},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Prosecutors had argued that DePape \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11985847/federal-prosecutors-request-40-year-sentence-for-david-depape-who-attacked-pelosis-husband-with-a-hammer\">should be sentenced to 40 years in prison\u003c/a> because of his violent plot to kidnap the then-speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“This was an \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11986566/prosecutors-push-for-terrorism-enhancement-in-sentencing-of-david-depape-who-bludgeoned-paul-pelosi-in-2022\">act of domestic terrorism\u003c/a>,” a federal prosecutor argued during the sentencing hearing on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She referenced a January 2023 call DePape \u003ca href=\"https://www.ktvu.com/news/depape-in-bizarre-phone-call-to-ktvu-says-he-should-have-been-more-prepared\">made from a jail cell to a KTVU reporter\u003c/a>. “He claimed to be a patriot. He wishes he’d gotten more of them. This is no patriot. This is a domestic terrorist, and it is a lone wolf domestic terrorist.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Judge Corley also referenced DePape’s statement during the call that he was sorry he didn’t “get more of them.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It sounds like he’s taunting his victims,” Corley said from the bench. “He’s taunting America.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The judge said she believes DePape continues to pose a danger to the public. Despite several chances to change course that night in the Pelosi home, he continued with “completely gratuitous” violence, Corley said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Defense attorney Angela Chuang argued that a 14-year sentence was more appropriate.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“DePape was at a very low point in his life” in the months leading up to the attack, she said in court on Friday. “His living situation was bad. He didn’t have bathroom access.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She added that he was spending “every waking hour \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11966865/defense-focuses-on-conspiracy-theories-in-first-day-of-trial-over-attempted-nancy-pelosi-kidnapping\">listening to conspiracy theories\u003c/a> promoted by people in places of power, who command respect” as his mental health deteriorated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape’s federal public defenders filed a notice of appeal Friday afternoon, saying they intend to challenge both the judgment and sentence he received.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape received over a year and a half of credit for his time in custody awaiting trial and sentencing. He faces potential deportation to Canada after his prison sentence, according to statements by the judge and attorneys in court on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape will \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11968645/david-depape-faces-second-trial-for-attempting-to-kidnap-nancy-pelosi-heres-why\">go to trial in state court\u003c/a> in the coming weeks. He is facing multiple state charges, including attempted murder, residential burglary, seriously injuring an elder adult, assault with a deadly weapon, false imprisonment and threatening a public official’s family member. Jury selection is expected to begin Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11986718/david-depape-sentenced-to-30-years-in-federal-prison-for-attack-on-nancy-pelosis-husband","authors":["11490","3206"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_17725","news_31923","news_27626","news_177","news_31916","news_29025"],"featImg":"news_11967248","label":"news"},"news_11986566":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11986566","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11986566","score":null,"sort":[1715943646000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715943646,"format":"standard","title":"Prosecutors to Push for Terrorism Enhancement in Sentencing of David DePape, Who Bludgeoned Paul Pelosi in 2022","headTitle":"Prosecutors to Push for Terrorism Enhancement in Sentencing of David DePape, Who Bludgeoned Paul Pelosi in 2022 | KQED","content":"\u003cp>The man who broke into former U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s San Francisco home in 2022 and bludgeoned her husband, Paul Pelosi, in the head with a hammer is set to be sentenced in federal court on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prosecutors argue that David DePape should be sentenced to 40 years in prison because his violent plot to kidnap Pelosi amounts to terrorism. DePape’s attorneys are seeking a 14-year sentence, arguing that his mental illness left him susceptible to the extremist conspiracy theories that fueled his actions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“At a time when extremism has led to attacks on public and elected officials, this case presents a moment to speak to others harboring ideologically motivated violent dreams and plans,” the government argued in a May 10 sentencing memorandum. “The defendant planned a violent hostage-taking of the Speaker Emerita and then nearly killed her husband.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rory Little, a law professor at UC Law San Francisco, said federal prosecutors are trying to make a point about the gravity of DePape’s crimes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They’re saying this is a really serious attack on an important federal official, and you need to take it seriously,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape, 44, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967595/david-depape-found-guilty-in-paul-pelosi-hammer-attack\">was convicted\u003c/a> by a federal jury in November of one count of attempted kidnapping of a federal officer and one count of assault on the immediate family member of a federal official.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Defense attorneys argue that applying the terrorism enhancement would be an illegal overreach because neither of the crimes he was convicted of fit within the legal definition of a “federal crime of terrorism.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“His entire adult life was indelibly shaped and distorted by an abusive, long-term relationship,” DePape’s attorneys argue in their sentencing memorandum. They say he became “completely unmoored in the years leading up to the offense when he was further radicalized through his obsessive consumption of media amplifying extreme beliefs.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The U.S. Probation Office recommends 25 years, followed by five years of supervised release.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At a weeklong trial late last year, the jury heard and saw a mountain of evidence against DePape, including video footage of the break-in and attack and his repeated confessions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape broke into the Pelosi home early in the morning on Oct. 28, 2022, looking for the congresswoman, who he planned to kidnap and question on video. Nancy Pelosi wasn’t home. DePape instead woke up Paul Pelosi, who then managed to call 911 from a bathroom.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Body cam footage showed that when police arrived at the house, Pelosi opened the door with one hand on a hammer that DePape was holding. Both men appeared calm. But after an officer told DePape to drop the hammer, he responded, “Nope,” and abruptly turned to Pelosi, striking him violently on the head with the tool.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside tag=\"david-depape\" label=\"More Related Stories\"]DePape later told police that if he had found Nancy Pelosi and she had lied, he would have broken her kneecaps, according to court records.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“He also told Mr. Pelosi that Speaker Emerita Pelosi was ‘the leader of the pack’ and that the defendant ‘had to take her out,’” the government’s sentencing memo reads.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Lurking in the background of this is the idea that this guy is dangerous because he appears to have a mentally unbalanced view of the world, and he doesn’t appear to have retreated from that mental imbalance,” said Little, the law professor.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>According to his own testimony during his trial, DePape planned to wear an inflatable unicorn costume while livestreaming his questioning of Pelosi, but she wasn’t his ultimate target. Rather, he hoped to lure feminist theorist and cultural anthropologist at the University of Michigan Gayle Rubin, whose identity is sealed in federal court behind the pseudonym “Target 1.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Target 1” is among those subpoenaed for the sentencing hearing on Friday, according to court records.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape’s attorneys argue that previously undiagnosed mental health issues made him vulnerable to “manipulation and unusual beliefs.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Mr. DePape’s beliefs did not come out of nowhere,” a sentencing memo said, adding that a redacted mental health condition “made him ‘especially vulnerable to believing QAnon conspiracy theories, and to being especially psychologically affected by their content.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“QAnon adherents rarely self-identity as such, and Mr. DePape is no different. But his beliefs are consistent with QAnon theories,” attorneys wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The prosecution argues that DePape’s isolation and consumption of YouTube videos “do not excuse the instant offense, nor give a reason for leniency given the violent extremism that the defendant unleashed in October 2022.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>His defense attorneys said his actions were also heavily influenced by his relationship with the pro-nudity activist Gypsy Taub, with whom DePape shares three children.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“His long-term relationship with his ex-partner, Gypsy Taub, inflicted immeasurable harm to his mental state and what little support network he had in the form of his family,” they argue.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prosecutors argue DePape hasn’t accepted responsibility for his crimes and is proud of what he did, pointing to his jail-house January 2023 phone call to a KTVU reporter, during which he apologized to the American people, saying he should have come “better prepared” to the Pelosis’ home on the night of the attack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You’re welcome,” he told the TV station. “The tree of liberty isn’t dying. It’s being killed, systematically and deliberately.” He added, “The tree of liberty needs watering.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape is currently in custody at the San Francisco County Jail. U.S. District Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley is set to deliver DePape’s sentence in federal court on Friday morning.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11968645/david-depape-faces-second-trial-for-attempting-to-kidnap-nancy-pelosi-heres-why\">A second trial in state court\u003c/a> will start in the coming weeks. In that case, DePape is facing charges including attempted murder, residential burglary, seriously injuring an elder adult, assault with a deadly weapon, false imprisonment and threatening a public official’s family member.\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":1043,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":29},"modified":1715915842,"excerpt":"Prosecutors are expected to argue that DePape deserves an enhanced sentence of 40 years because his violent plot to kidnap Nancy Pelosi – U.S. House speaker at the time – amounts to an act of terrorism. The defense is likely to seek leniency for the defendant on the grounds he was radicalized by online extremism.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Prosecutors are expected to argue that DePape deserves an enhanced sentence of 40 years because his violent plot to kidnap Nancy Pelosi – U.S. House speaker at the time – amounts to an act of terrorism. The defense is likely to seek leniency for the defendant on the grounds he was radicalized by online extremism.","title":"Prosecutors to Push for Terrorism Enhancement in Sentencing of David DePape, Who Bludgeoned Paul Pelosi in 2022 | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Prosecutors to Push for Terrorism Enhancement in Sentencing of David DePape, Who Bludgeoned Paul Pelosi in 2022","datePublished":"2024-05-17T04:00:46-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-16T20:17:22-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"prosecutors-push-for-terrorism-enhancement-in-sentencing-of-david-depape-who-bludgeoned-paul-pelosi-in-2022","status":"publish","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11986566/prosecutors-push-for-terrorism-enhancement-in-sentencing-of-david-depape-who-bludgeoned-paul-pelosi-in-2022","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>The man who broke into former U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s San Francisco home in 2022 and bludgeoned her husband, Paul Pelosi, in the head with a hammer is set to be sentenced in federal court on Friday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prosecutors argue that David DePape should be sentenced to 40 years in prison because his violent plot to kidnap Pelosi amounts to terrorism. DePape’s attorneys are seeking a 14-year sentence, arguing that his mental illness left him susceptible to the extremist conspiracy theories that fueled his actions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“At a time when extremism has led to attacks on public and elected officials, this case presents a moment to speak to others harboring ideologically motivated violent dreams and plans,” the government argued in a May 10 sentencing memorandum. “The defendant planned a violent hostage-taking of the Speaker Emerita and then nearly killed her husband.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rory Little, a law professor at UC Law San Francisco, said federal prosecutors are trying to make a point about the gravity of DePape’s crimes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They’re saying this is a really serious attack on an important federal official, and you need to take it seriously,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape, 44, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967595/david-depape-found-guilty-in-paul-pelosi-hammer-attack\">was convicted\u003c/a> by a federal jury in November of one count of attempted kidnapping of a federal officer and one count of assault on the immediate family member of a federal official.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Defense attorneys argue that applying the terrorism enhancement would be an illegal overreach because neither of the crimes he was convicted of fit within the legal definition of a “federal crime of terrorism.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“His entire adult life was indelibly shaped and distorted by an abusive, long-term relationship,” DePape’s attorneys argue in their sentencing memorandum. They say he became “completely unmoored in the years leading up to the offense when he was further radicalized through his obsessive consumption of media amplifying extreme beliefs.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The U.S. Probation Office recommends 25 years, followed by five years of supervised release.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At a weeklong trial late last year, the jury heard and saw a mountain of evidence against DePape, including video footage of the break-in and attack and his repeated confessions.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape broke into the Pelosi home early in the morning on Oct. 28, 2022, looking for the congresswoman, who he planned to kidnap and question on video. Nancy Pelosi wasn’t home. DePape instead woke up Paul Pelosi, who then managed to call 911 from a bathroom.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Body cam footage showed that when police arrived at the house, Pelosi opened the door with one hand on a hammer that DePape was holding. Both men appeared calm. But after an officer told DePape to drop the hammer, he responded, “Nope,” and abruptly turned to Pelosi, striking him violently on the head with the tool.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"tag":"david-depape","label":"More Related Stories "},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>DePape later told police that if he had found Nancy Pelosi and she had lied, he would have broken her kneecaps, according to court records.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“He also told Mr. Pelosi that Speaker Emerita Pelosi was ‘the leader of the pack’ and that the defendant ‘had to take her out,’” the government’s sentencing memo reads.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Lurking in the background of this is the idea that this guy is dangerous because he appears to have a mentally unbalanced view of the world, and he doesn’t appear to have retreated from that mental imbalance,” said Little, the law professor.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>According to his own testimony during his trial, DePape planned to wear an inflatable unicorn costume while livestreaming his questioning of Pelosi, but she wasn’t his ultimate target. Rather, he hoped to lure feminist theorist and cultural anthropologist at the University of Michigan Gayle Rubin, whose identity is sealed in federal court behind the pseudonym “Target 1.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Target 1” is among those subpoenaed for the sentencing hearing on Friday, according to court records.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape’s attorneys argue that previously undiagnosed mental health issues made him vulnerable to “manipulation and unusual beliefs.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Mr. DePape’s beliefs did not come out of nowhere,” a sentencing memo said, adding that a redacted mental health condition “made him ‘especially vulnerable to believing QAnon conspiracy theories, and to being especially psychologically affected by their content.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“QAnon adherents rarely self-identity as such, and Mr. DePape is no different. But his beliefs are consistent with QAnon theories,” attorneys wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The prosecution argues that DePape’s isolation and consumption of YouTube videos “do not excuse the instant offense, nor give a reason for leniency given the violent extremism that the defendant unleashed in October 2022.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>His defense attorneys said his actions were also heavily influenced by his relationship with the pro-nudity activist Gypsy Taub, with whom DePape shares three children.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“His long-term relationship with his ex-partner, Gypsy Taub, inflicted immeasurable harm to his mental state and what little support network he had in the form of his family,” they argue.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prosecutors argue DePape hasn’t accepted responsibility for his crimes and is proud of what he did, pointing to his jail-house January 2023 phone call to a KTVU reporter, during which he apologized to the American people, saying he should have come “better prepared” to the Pelosis’ home on the night of the attack.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You’re welcome,” he told the TV station. “The tree of liberty isn’t dying. It’s being killed, systematically and deliberately.” He added, “The tree of liberty needs watering.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>DePape is currently in custody at the San Francisco County Jail. U.S. District Judge Jacqueline Scott Corley is set to deliver DePape’s sentence in federal court on Friday morning.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11968645/david-depape-faces-second-trial-for-attempting-to-kidnap-nancy-pelosi-heres-why\">A second trial in state court\u003c/a> will start in the coming weeks. In that case, DePape is facing charges including attempted murder, residential burglary, seriously injuring an elder adult, assault with a deadly weapon, false imprisonment and threatening a public official’s family member.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11986566/prosecutors-push-for-terrorism-enhancement-in-sentencing-of-david-depape-who-bludgeoned-paul-pelosi-in-2022","authors":["11490"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_28537","news_17725","news_31923","news_177","news_31916","news_29025"],"featImg":"news_11966873","label":"news"},"news_11986422":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11986422","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11986422","score":null,"sort":[1715813697000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715813697,"format":"standard","title":"SF Jury Acquits Man Accused of Castro Hate Crimes After Nearly a Year in Jail","headTitle":"SF Jury Acquits Man Accused of Castro Hate Crimes After Nearly a Year in Jail | KQED","content":"\u003cp>A San Francisco jury acquitted a man who spent nearly a year in custody after he was accused of shouting anti-gay slurs and throwing a glass object at two men in the Castro, his attorneys said Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Muhammed Abdullah, 21, was wrongly charged with battery, theft, assault and hate crime allegations in connection with two incidents from last June, according to the San Francisco public defender’s office. He had no previous criminal record.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A police officer admitted in court that “he had misrepresented the facts in a police report” from June 3, the public defender’s office said, adding that police also failed to investigate a separate June 5 incident properly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The San Francisco Police Department and the district attorney’s office did not immediately respond to a request for comment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the June 3 incident, the original police report said Abdullah attacked someone unprovoked. But Abdullah was acquitted of battery because he fought back in self-defense after he was grabbed from behind by someone offended by a sign Abdullah was carrying, the public defender’s office wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the June 5 incident, Mission Station SFPD officers detained Abdullah on 18th and Church streets after reports of an aggravated assault, according to an SFPD statement at the time. Police alleged Abdullah was following two men down the street, shouting anti-LGBTQ language at them. Abdullah was booked on counts of assault with a deadly weapon and two counts of committing a hate crime, as well as resisting arrest.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“These kinds of attacks are unacceptable,” Police Chief William Scott said in a statement last year. “It’s especially troubling that this incident took place as we celebrate Pride month in San Francisco. Anyone who threatens or harms someone based on being a member of the LGBTQ community will be held accountable.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The district attorney’s office wrote, in a statement, that they take every case seriously and put forward their best case based on the evidence and legal burden of proof. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Our office was presented with evidence that Mr. Abdullah attacked three members of the LGBTQ community in the Castro on June 3, 2023, and June 5, 2023, and when he did so, he expressed homophobic views verbally and in writing,” said the DA’s statement sent to KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>However, according to the public defender’s office, “police failed to gather any forensic evidence or available surveillance footage to support” the claim that Abdullah had thrown a glass object at the men.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The jury was rightfully critical of the misleading police work and held the state to its burden of proof, which was wholly insufficient in this case,” said Tal Klement, a deputy public defender who represented Abdullah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Abdullah was in a mental health crisis the day he was arrested, the public defender’s office said. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He continued to speak out against LGTBQ people in court, the Bay Area Reporter wrote in June last year. The LGBTQ community is “against God” and “going against families,” Abdullah said, \u003ca href=\"https://www.ebar.com/story.php?ch=news&sc=crime&id=325948\">according to the newspaper\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The newspaper also reported Abdullah was screaming to himself in jail before he appeared before Superior Court Judge Victor Hwang in June.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Abdullah was jailed ahead of trial because the court ruled he was a risk to public safety, denying his petition for a mental health diversion, according to the district attorney’s office.\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":585,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":17},"modified":1715821831,"excerpt":"The man accused of shouting anti-gay slurs and throwing glass at men was wrongly charged on the basis of \"misleading police work\" and insufficient evidence, the San Francisco public defender's office said.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"The man accused of shouting anti-gay slurs and throwing glass at men was wrongly charged on the basis of "misleading police work" and insufficient evidence, the San Francisco public defender's office said.","title":"SF Jury Acquits Man Accused of Castro Hate Crimes After Nearly a Year in Jail | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"SF Jury Acquits Man Accused of Castro Hate Crimes After Nearly a Year in Jail","datePublished":"2024-05-15T15:54:57-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-15T18:10:31-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"sf-jury-acquits-man-accused-of-castro-hate-crimes-after-nearly-a-year-in-jail","status":"publish","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"articleAge":"0","nprStoryId":"kqed-11986422","path":"/news/11986422/sf-jury-acquits-man-accused-of-castro-hate-crimes-after-nearly-a-year-in-jail","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>A San Francisco jury acquitted a man who spent nearly a year in custody after he was accused of shouting anti-gay slurs and throwing a glass object at two men in the Castro, his attorneys said Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Muhammed Abdullah, 21, was wrongly charged with battery, theft, assault and hate crime allegations in connection with two incidents from last June, according to the San Francisco public defender’s office. He had no previous criminal record.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A police officer admitted in court that “he had misrepresented the facts in a police report” from June 3, the public defender’s office said, adding that police also failed to investigate a separate June 5 incident properly.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The San Francisco Police Department and the district attorney’s office did not immediately respond to a request for comment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the June 3 incident, the original police report said Abdullah attacked someone unprovoked. But Abdullah was acquitted of battery because he fought back in self-defense after he was grabbed from behind by someone offended by a sign Abdullah was carrying, the public defender’s office wrote.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the June 5 incident, Mission Station SFPD officers detained Abdullah on 18th and Church streets after reports of an aggravated assault, according to an SFPD statement at the time. Police alleged Abdullah was following two men down the street, shouting anti-LGBTQ language at them. Abdullah was booked on counts of assault with a deadly weapon and two counts of committing a hate crime, as well as resisting arrest.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“These kinds of attacks are unacceptable,” Police Chief William Scott said in a statement last year. “It’s especially troubling that this incident took place as we celebrate Pride month in San Francisco. Anyone who threatens or harms someone based on being a member of the LGBTQ community will be held accountable.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The district attorney’s office wrote, in a statement, that they take every case seriously and put forward their best case based on the evidence and legal burden of proof. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Our office was presented with evidence that Mr. Abdullah attacked three members of the LGBTQ community in the Castro on June 3, 2023, and June 5, 2023, and when he did so, he expressed homophobic views verbally and in writing,” said the DA’s statement sent to KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>However, according to the public defender’s office, “police failed to gather any forensic evidence or available surveillance footage to support” the claim that Abdullah had thrown a glass object at the men.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The jury was rightfully critical of the misleading police work and held the state to its burden of proof, which was wholly insufficient in this case,” said Tal Klement, a deputy public defender who represented Abdullah.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Abdullah was in a mental health crisis the day he was arrested, the public defender’s office said. \u003c/p>\n\u003cp>He continued to speak out against LGTBQ people in court, the Bay Area Reporter wrote in June last year. The LGBTQ community is “against God” and “going against families,” Abdullah said, \u003ca href=\"https://www.ebar.com/story.php?ch=news&sc=crime&id=325948\">according to the newspaper\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The newspaper also reported Abdullah was screaming to himself in jail before he appeared before Superior Court Judge Victor Hwang in June.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Abdullah was jailed ahead of trial because the court ruled he was a risk to public safety, denying his petition for a mental health diversion, according to the district attorney’s office.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11986422/sf-jury-acquits-man-accused-of-castro-hate-crimes-after-nearly-a-year-in-jail","authors":["11690"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8"],"tags":["news_21534","news_17725","news_4273","news_38"],"featImg":"news_11634607","label":"news"},"news_11986351":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11986351","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11986351","score":null,"sort":[1715801024000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715801024,"format":"standard","title":"Family of Man Suffocated by Antioch Police Restraint to Get $7.5 Million Settlement","headTitle":"Family of Man Suffocated by Antioch Police Restraint to Get $7.5 Million Settlement | KQED","content":"\u003cp>The city of Antioch has agreed to a $7.5 million settlement with the family of Angelo Quinto, a 30-year-old Navy veteran who \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11863507/will-angelo-quintos-death-lead-to-police-reforms-in-antioch\">died at the hands of Antioch police officers\u003c/a> in 2020, according to an attorney for his family.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto was having a mental health emergency in his home on Dec. 23, 2020, when Antioch police forcibly restrained him, leading to his death by suffocation, according to the family’s civil rights lawsuit. That night, his family called police after he began to act paranoid and agitated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Two officers arrived to find Quinto held in his mother’s arms and pulled him from her grasp, flipping him onto his stomach, according to a wrongful death claim filed by the family. As they did, Quinto called out, “Please don’t kill me,” at least twice, the claim said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The officers crossed Quinto’s legs behind him and took turns kneeling on his neck, according to the claim, which said he started bleeding from his mouth after being restrained for nearly five minutes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Paramedics began CPR and took Quinto to a hospital, where he was declared dead three days later.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto’s family has been committed to improving the Antioch community’s relationship with the city police after his death, including pushing for \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11868075/after-angelo-quintos-death-momentum-builds-to-add-mental-health-curriculum-in-police-training\">changes to how the department responds\u003c/a> to calls involving mentally or emotionally impaired individuals, said attorney John Burris, who announced the settlement in a press release on Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s really the only sense of justice we can get that really means anything to us,” Bella Collins-Quinto, Angelo Quinto’s sister, told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If he couldn’t have life, we do believe he might choose this — this legacy, this role in ensuring that other families and victims of police violence don’t have to endure the same traumas that we’ve had.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside label='More Antioch Police Coverage' tag='antioch-police-department']Antioch police have introduced body-worn cameras, a mental health crisis team, and a mobile crisis unit, among other efforts to better respond to those suffering mental health emergencies.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto’s family has also been active in the \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1984670/california-bans-discredited-excited-delirium-term-in-police-custody-deaths\">effort to ban the term “excited delirium”\u003c/a> as a cause of death in California. They partnered with Assemblymember Mike Gipson (D-Carson) to pass a bill banning the term and related phrases from being recognized as a medical diagnosis or cause of death in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Excited delirium” was listed as the cause of death in Quinto’s initial autopsy, though a secondary autopsy commissioned by his family’s legal team found that suffocation in a restrained position was the cause of death. The Contra Costa County coroner who completed the initial autopsy later revised his opinion, agreeing with the secondary report.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Separate litigation over the classification of Quinto’s death is ongoing and should be decided later this year. Ben Nisenbaum, the family’s attorney, said they are seeking to have the death \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11887516/why-was-angelo-quintos-death-ruled-an-accident\">reclassified from an “accident”\u003c/a> to a homicide.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Collins-Quinto said that she and her family plan to continue advocating for social justice reform within the Antioch Police Department and more broadly. Currently, they are pushing Contra Costa County to fully separate the county coroner’s office from the sheriff to ensure objectivity in the determination of cause and manner of death.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Today might be the end of our civil suit, but we’ve only just really begun striving for social change,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This story was updated at 1:43 p.m. with additional reporting from KQED’s Tara Siler.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":624,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":17},"modified":1715808020,"excerpt":"Antioch will settle a civil rights lawsuit filed by the family of Angelo Quinto, who died after police kneeled on his neck in 2020.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Antioch will settle a civil rights lawsuit filed by the family of Angelo Quinto, who died after police kneeled on his neck in 2020.","title":"Family of Man Suffocated by Antioch Police Restraint to Get $7.5 Million Settlement | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Family of Man Suffocated by Antioch Police Restraint to Get $7.5 Million Settlement","datePublished":"2024-05-15T12:23:44-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-15T14:20:20-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"family-of-man-suffocated-by-antioch-police-restraint-to-get-7-5-million-settlement","status":"publish","nprByline":"\u003ca href=\"https://twitter.com/katie_debe?lang=en\">Katie DeBenedetti\u003c/a>","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"showOnAuthorArchivePages":"No","articleAge":"0","nprStoryId":"kqed-11986351","path":"/news/11986351/family-of-man-suffocated-by-antioch-police-restraint-to-get-7-5-million-settlement","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>The city of Antioch has agreed to a $7.5 million settlement with the family of Angelo Quinto, a 30-year-old Navy veteran who \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11863507/will-angelo-quintos-death-lead-to-police-reforms-in-antioch\">died at the hands of Antioch police officers\u003c/a> in 2020, according to an attorney for his family.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto was having a mental health emergency in his home on Dec. 23, 2020, when Antioch police forcibly restrained him, leading to his death by suffocation, according to the family’s civil rights lawsuit. That night, his family called police after he began to act paranoid and agitated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Two officers arrived to find Quinto held in his mother’s arms and pulled him from her grasp, flipping him onto his stomach, according to a wrongful death claim filed by the family. As they did, Quinto called out, “Please don’t kill me,” at least twice, the claim said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The officers crossed Quinto’s legs behind him and took turns kneeling on his neck, according to the claim, which said he started bleeding from his mouth after being restrained for nearly five minutes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Paramedics began CPR and took Quinto to a hospital, where he was declared dead three days later.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto’s family has been committed to improving the Antioch community’s relationship with the city police after his death, including pushing for \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11868075/after-angelo-quintos-death-momentum-builds-to-add-mental-health-curriculum-in-police-training\">changes to how the department responds\u003c/a> to calls involving mentally or emotionally impaired individuals, said attorney John Burris, who announced the settlement in a press release on Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s really the only sense of justice we can get that really means anything to us,” Bella Collins-Quinto, Angelo Quinto’s sister, told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If he couldn’t have life, we do believe he might choose this — this legacy, this role in ensuring that other families and victims of police violence don’t have to endure the same traumas that we’ve had.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"label":"More Antioch Police Coverage ","tag":"antioch-police-department"},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>Antioch police have introduced body-worn cameras, a mental health crisis team, and a mobile crisis unit, among other efforts to better respond to those suffering mental health emergencies.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Quinto’s family has also been active in the \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/science/1984670/california-bans-discredited-excited-delirium-term-in-police-custody-deaths\">effort to ban the term “excited delirium”\u003c/a> as a cause of death in California. They partnered with Assemblymember Mike Gipson (D-Carson) to pass a bill banning the term and related phrases from being recognized as a medical diagnosis or cause of death in California.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Excited delirium” was listed as the cause of death in Quinto’s initial autopsy, though a secondary autopsy commissioned by his family’s legal team found that suffocation in a restrained position was the cause of death. The Contra Costa County coroner who completed the initial autopsy later revised his opinion, agreeing with the secondary report.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Separate litigation over the classification of Quinto’s death is ongoing and should be decided later this year. Ben Nisenbaum, the family’s attorney, said they are seeking to have the death \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11887516/why-was-angelo-quintos-death-ruled-an-accident\">reclassified from an “accident”\u003c/a> to a homicide.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Collins-Quinto said that she and her family plan to continue advocating for social justice reform within the Antioch Police Department and more broadly. Currently, they are pushing Contra Costa County to fully separate the county coroner’s office from the sheriff to ensure objectivity in the determination of cause and manner of death.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Today might be the end of our civil suit, but we’ve only just really begun striving for social change,” she said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>This story was updated at 1:43 p.m. with additional reporting from KQED’s Tara Siler.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11986351/family-of-man-suffocated-by-antioch-police-restraint-to-get-7-5-million-settlement","authors":["byline_news_11986351"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8"],"tags":["news_29221","news_19122","news_32621","news_17725","news_27626"],"featImg":"news_11986358","label":"news"},"news_11985965":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11985965","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11985965","score":null,"sort":[1715684417000]},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"we-approach-in-peace-are-barts-outreach-efforts-to-help-people-in-crisis-working","title":"'We Approach in Peace': Are BART's Efforts to Help People in Crisis Working?","publishDate":1715684417,"format":"standard","headTitle":"‘We Approach in Peace’: Are BART’s Efforts to Help People in Crisis Working? | KQED","labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"content":"\u003cp>On a recent rainy morning, Stephine Barnes paces slowly through a covered outdoor walkway off the main entrance of the San Leandro BART station.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People like to camp out here because you have shelter. There’s no rain, it’s dry. So people just find little nooks and crannies,” Barnes says, surveying the area. “It’s usually where we find a lot of people in the wee hours of the morning, sleeping, camped out, wandering around.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Barnes is a BART crisis intervention specialist, and her job entails seeking out and offering help to the many people in the sprawling transit system struggling with lack of shelter, mental health problems or addiction. She and her partner for the day, Natalie Robinson, are part of the agency’s ambitious new efforts to address a slew of human crises that show up on BART’s trains and platforms every day — without involving the police.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They spot a young woman with glasses and a purple bow in her hair who is hastily pulling belongings from a bike locker. Two roller bags, a dirty blanket and a ragged stuffed octopus are among the random array of possessions splayed on the ground around her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Barnes and Robinson approach cautiously, mindful of a large Rottweiler sitting nearby.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We like to connect people with resources,” Robinson says. “So if you have a need for shelter, housing, anything like that, you can let us know.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The woman, who gives her name as Cat, seems tentative but receptive. She tells them her boyfriend arrived recently from Southern California. They had been living in their car and storing their belongings in the bike locker. But BART police had just ordered them to clear out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cat nods to the dog, which sports a black-and-white smiley face bandana around its neck. “That’s Einstein,” she says. “He’s our son.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Oh, my goodness, you’re just a sweetheart,” Barnes exclaims, patting the dog’s head.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979248\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979248 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A middle-aged Black woman speaks to a younger woman wearing a purple hair decoration.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Outside the San Leandro Bart station, BART Crisis Intervention Specialist Stephine Barnes tells an unhoused person named Cat about a nearby housing assistance program. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>She tells Cat to take her time retrieving her belongings, and emphasizes that she and Robinson are not police officers and aren’t there to pressure her to leave.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If you guys are interested in getting on the list for permanent housing in Alameda County, there’s a place called Hedco in Hayward,” Barnes tells her. “You can get coffee in the morning and all that kind of stuff. And then they put you in line on how to get these resources for housing and all of those things Alameda County offers.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Robinson explains how to get there and hands Cat her card, telling her to call if she needs anything.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I’m really bad with resources, honestly. So this is great,” Cat says, stuffing the card in her jacket pocket and continuing her hurried packing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You don’t have to be out here forever,” Robinson says as she and Barnes wish Cat luck and head back toward the station.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They’ll probably never know if she follows through.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It varies widely,” Robinson says. “We could bring someone to a resource, and they literally don’t walk in the door, or we connect somebody, and they follow all the way through.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>‘Customer service on steroids’\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In 2021, Barnes and Robinson, both seasoned BART employees, were among the first to join the crisis intervention team, now a 20-member crew dispatched throughout the 50-station transit system to offer help to people who appear to be overtly in need of it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Finding that population has gotten a good deal easier in recent years, amid a discernible uptick in the number of people on BART’s trains and platforms experiencing homelessness or suffering from serious mental health issues — a trend that mirrors \u003ca href=\"https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/homeless-populations-surge-11-in-san-jose-and-8-17176329.php\">the overall surge\u003c/a> in the Bay Area’s unhoused population since the start of the pandemic.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART realized “a lot of the problems that were happening outside the station were coming inside the station,” says Barnes, 53, who was a station agent for 27 years, most recently at the Coliseum station in Oakland, before taking this job. “And, of course, as an agent, you see that firsthand.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART’s boots-on-the-ground outreach approach, launched in the depths of the pandemic, marks a notable foray into social services for an agency whose main objective has always been getting people from point A to point B.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The effort comes as BART struggles to recoup ridership, which \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/202403%20MRR.pdf\">still hovers at just over 40%\u003c/a> of pre-pandemic levels, and as riders \u003ca href=\"https://www.bayareacouncil.org/press-releases/new-poll-overwhelming-support-for-more-police-on-bart-greater-focus-on-cleanliness-and-stronger-enforcement-of-rules/\">consistently say in surveys that \u003c/a>they’re most dissatisfied with how the agency addresses homelessness.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11986011\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11986011 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg\" alt=\"Two middle-aged women in dark-blue uniforms speak to an unseen passenger on a BART train.\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1280\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg 1920w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-1536x1024.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (left) and Stephine Barnes check on the well-being of a BART passenger they think might need help. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Those factors have prompted BART’s leaders to ratchet up funding for crisis intervention and related services — to the tune of $11 million last year, \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/docs/Homeless%20Action%20Plan.pdf\">according to the agency’s 2023 homeless action plan\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People have seen a need for something different than what everyone was doing before, which was, ‘Call the police, call the police, call the police,’” says Barnes, who describes her job as “customer service on steroids.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Most jobs at BART have existed since the agency started running trains more than 50 years ago, she notes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“There was nothing, though, that really addressed the mental health component or the homelessness crisis that we’re experiencing in the Bay Area,” Barnes says. “So when I first read [about the job], I thought, ‘Wow, this is like the next-level customer service.’ Because some customers need more help than just buying a Clipper Card.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The CISes, as they’re called, operate under the auspices of BART’s Police Department. But they wear distinctive, labeled uniforms and roam the stations and trains of their assigned zone in pairs, unaccompanied by sworn officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They also have no enforcement power and don’t carry any weapons.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They’re armed, instead, with latex gloves, Narcan — used to reverse opioid overdoses — and police radios in the event they need backup. And they use electronic notepads to document and tally their interactions, data the agency hopes will eventually demonstrate the still-undetermined effectiveness of the program.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Some CISes, like Robinson, 49, who worked as a BART police dispatcher for 16 years, also load their pockets with snacks to hand out. Others carry extra pairs of clean socks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Much of the help CISes offer comes in the form of referrals to a collection of social service and mental health nonprofits sprinkled throughout BART’s five-county service area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We get to do God’s work out here,” Robinson says. “We’re helping people who are unhoused, who have substance-abuse issues, mental health issues. And being able to connect them to the proper service — those who are willing to make changes in their life — it’s just really rewarding.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>Signs of distress\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>On this morning, Barnes and Robinson are about midway through an 8-hour shift, one that began at 5 a.m. and has taken them back and forth multiple times across their zone, from San Leandro to Lake Merritt stations. Much of that is spent patrolling train cars and platforms, searching for telltale signs of distress.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We pay attention to maybe some drug paraphernalia, someone who might be passed out, and check on their welfare,” Robinson says. “And then we’re also patrolling stations and just interacting with the public and building relationships with individuals that we see on a repeat basis.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART station agents and train operators can reach out to the CISes for help dealing with difficult but non-threatening situations, Barnes says. Passengers can also now call BART police to request help from a non-sworn officer, and dispatchers are authorized to reroute certain 911 calls to them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979245\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979245 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A person in a bathrobe and slippers walks on a train platform.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A person in a bathrobe and slippers walks along the platform of the Fruitvale BART Station — someone that Crisis Intervention Specialist Stephine Barnes says she has interacted with multiple times. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>“We can be more accessible to the public than the officers can. They’re responding to emergencies, they’re responding to fights, they’re responding to someone with a weapon,” Barnes says. “But we can take the time out. If you need to talk to me for an hour, you have me for an hour. If I need to escort you on the train, and I need to take you to a resource that’s 30, 40 minutes away, I have the time to do that.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Even when people are in their worst state, Barnes says, they’re still generally grateful to have someone checking in on them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I mean, of course, there are times when you’re going to be called names and told ‘Get away, you’re going to get your ass kicked,’ she says. “But I got that more as a station agent than I have in this position.”[aside label=\"more on homelessness\" tag=\"homelessness\"]BART says CISes “\u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2023/news20230103-2\">have a background in social work\u003c/a>” or related experience and receive a month-long training that focuses on conflict resolution and de-escalation techniques for people suffering from mental health, homelessness and substance-abuse issues.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We’re all trained in how to come in peace. So when we approach, we approach in peace,” Barnes says. “It’s about a greeting. It’s about, ‘Hey, how are you? How are you doing? How can I best support you?’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And a lot of times, they’re very receptive to it,” she says. “But it takes time. Relationships take time.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Over roughly two hours that morning, Barnes and Robinson ask about 10 people if they need some help, including several semi-conscious riders slumped over on their seats and an older man near the entrance of the Coliseum station wrapped in a dirty blanket, muttering to himself. All, except Cat, the woman they encountered at San Leandro station, wave them off.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the last quarter of 2023, CISes \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/2024-02/Quarterly%20Service%20Performance%20Review%20-%20Second%20Quarter%20Fiscal%20Year%202024%20-%20Presentation%20%281%29.pdf\">reported having more than 4,500 contacts\u003c/a>, of which 210 — just under 5% — resulted in verifiable connections to service providers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s a game of patience. It may be the first contact somebody is ready to seek that help. Sometimes it might be the 20th contact,” says Ja’Son Scott, deputy chief of BART’s nascent Progressive Policing and Community Engagement Bureau, which encompasses the CIS program.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Scott’s bureau was launched \u003ca href=\"https://www.sfexaminer.com/archives/unarmed-bart-ambassadors-program-formalized-with-a-focus-on-community-service/article_f74c861e-326f-585d-9014-44665369b258.html\">in the fall of 2020\u003c/a>, just months after George Floyd’s murder by Minneapolis police sparked nationwide protests for racial justice and police accountability. BART says its new approach, aimed at helping to restore ridership, came in response to mounting requests from passengers for an increased safety presence in the system but with less reliance on armed officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979241\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979241 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two women in uniform look through an open BART train door.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (left) and Stephine Barnes speak to passengers on a BART train that’s been stalled on the platform after a man reportedly flung a bag of feces-caked laundry around the first car. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>The initiative has an annual budget of roughly $8 million, and in addition to the 20 CISes, it includes up to 10 “transit ambassadors” who also patrol the system, reporting safety concerns and “biohazards.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>I realize we didn’t have all the tools as police officers to deal with all the issues that you see in BART, and it’s not always necessary for a police officer to do that,” Scott says. “We can’t arrest our way through these problems.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>Outreach vs. enforcement\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>BART’s social service efforts, however, haven’t always gone smoothly. The agency’s inspector general \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/docs/REPORT_%24350K%20for%20Homeless%20Outreach%20Yielded%20Unclear%20Results_Final_020323.pdf\">reported\u003c/a> last year that a $350,000 multiyear contract with the Salvation Army to address homelessness resulted in just one unsheltered person entering treatment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the same time, BART’s Police Department has ramped up enforcement, \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2024/news20240328\">reporting a 62% increase in arrests\u003c/a> last year while aggressively recruiting to fill vacant positions on its force by offering higher salaries and signing bonuses.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Those developments come as riders say they want to see more sworn officers in the system.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A \u003ca href=\"https://drive.zooce.com/management/builtinapps/fileoperator.aspx?child=1&a=D3B60E43-50D3-46D5-A799-2C3CECF14238&ro=1&fid=13728646727690992504_9832503603610834240\">2023 Bay Area Council poll\u003c/a> found three-fourths of respondents would make that a high priority. Four out of five agreed that people who violate BART’s code of conduct — rules that prohibit smoking, eating, and playing loud music, among other things — should be ejected from the system. And more than two-thirds of respondents said they thought BART should focus exclusively on running a clean, safe and reliable transit operation — while letting other public agencies deal with people in crisis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Debora Allen, a BART Board director, is among that majority. A staunch supporter of tougher law enforcement within the system, Allen was one of just two board members who voted against forming the Progressive Policing Bureau. And she remains dubious of its benefits.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Look, no one wants to help people who are down and out and in crisis more than me. I think all of us on that board have the same interest,” she says. But “transit isn’t the place to start social service programs. We have counties and cities who receive hundreds of millions of dollars each year to do this social service work. We should remain focused on transit.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979246\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979246 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A Narcan case on someone's belt.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Stephine Barnes and other crisis intervention specialists always carry Narcan, a drug used to reverse opioid overdoses. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Allen argues that BART is using scarce dollars to deliver services to people inside the system, all but incentivizing them to stay there, while offering little in the way of data to show if the program is actually helping people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What I have argued all along is our first line of defense should be to keep those people out of the system,” Allen says, decrying BART’s failure to clamp down on rampant fare evasion. \u003cb>“\u003c/b>Having them wandering and sometimes even living inside of a transit system with active moving trains all the time is the most dangerous place for them to decide to live.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>‘We are definitely needed’\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>At Lake Merritt station, Barnes and Robinson are dispatched to a Dublin-Pleasanton-bound train that’s been stalled on the platform after a man reportedly flung a bag of feces-caked laundry around the first car.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>So it was all over the train car. They say he wiped it out, but it definitely needs disinfecting,” Robinson says after speaking with the train operator.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They calmly head up the stairs and out of the station in pursuit of the man and spend about five minutes looking for him.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>We don’t see him anywhere. We always make an attempt to try to find somebody,” says Robinson, who had hoped to refer him to a shower and laundry truck that serves the area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To do this job successfully, she says, it’s important to not get too emotionally involved.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I mean, my personal outlook and training is that, you know, this is their life, their problems, their choices,” Robinson says. “So I can’t dwell necessarily on the feelings that are so associated with seeing so much human misery.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979243\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11979243\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two people in dark-blue uniforms talk to a BART train conductor.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (center) and Stephine Barnes speak to a BART train conductor about a man who had been causing a disturbance on the train. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>But Robinson says the support she and her team offer can be a game changer — if and when people actually accept it. She recounts trying to build a relationship, over months, with a young man she often saw riding the trains in her zone, obviously intoxicated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And then one day, he came and asked for us and said he was ready for recovery,” she says. “He needed somebody to dial the phone for him. He needed somebody to talk to his dad for him. He was literally at his lowest point in his life. And you need a hand in those moments.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She paused, waiting for the whine of a departing train to fade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“So yeah, we are definitely needed,” she says. “There needs to be a 100 of us, not just 20.”\u003cbr>\n[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad floatright]\u003c/p>\n","blocks":[],"excerpt":"BART's crisis intervention team is part of the transit agency's ambitious new strategy to reach out to the many people in the sprawling transit system who struggle with lack of shelter, mental health problems or addiction — without involving the police.","status":"publish","parent":0,"modified":1716500297,"stats":{"hasAudio":false,"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"hasPolis":false,"paragraphCount":64,"wordCount":2888},"headData":{"title":"'We Approach in Peace': Are BART's Efforts to Help People in Crisis Working? | KQED","description":"BART's crisis intervention team is part of the transit agency's ambitious new strategy to reach out to the many people in the sprawling transit system who struggle with lack of shelter, mental health problems or addiction — without involving the police.","ogTitle":"","ogDescription":"","ogImgId":"","twTitle":"","twDescription":"","twImgId":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"'We Approach in Peace': Are BART's Efforts to Help People in Crisis Working?","datePublished":"2024-05-14T04:00:17-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-23T14:38:17-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"sticky":false,"nprStoryId":"kqed-11985965","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11985965/we-approach-in-peace-are-barts-outreach-efforts-to-help-people-in-crisis-working","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>On a recent rainy morning, Stephine Barnes paces slowly through a covered outdoor walkway off the main entrance of the San Leandro BART station.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People like to camp out here because you have shelter. There’s no rain, it’s dry. So people just find little nooks and crannies,” Barnes says, surveying the area. “It’s usually where we find a lot of people in the wee hours of the morning, sleeping, camped out, wandering around.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Barnes is a BART crisis intervention specialist, and her job entails seeking out and offering help to the many people in the sprawling transit system struggling with lack of shelter, mental health problems or addiction. She and her partner for the day, Natalie Robinson, are part of the agency’s ambitious new efforts to address a slew of human crises that show up on BART’s trains and platforms every day — without involving the police.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They spot a young woman with glasses and a purple bow in her hair who is hastily pulling belongings from a bike locker. Two roller bags, a dirty blanket and a ragged stuffed octopus are among the random array of possessions splayed on the ground around her.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Barnes and Robinson approach cautiously, mindful of a large Rottweiler sitting nearby.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We like to connect people with resources,” Robinson says. “So if you have a need for shelter, housing, anything like that, you can let us know.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The woman, who gives her name as Cat, seems tentative but receptive. She tells them her boyfriend arrived recently from Southern California. They had been living in their car and storing their belongings in the bike locker. But BART police had just ordered them to clear out.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cat nods to the dog, which sports a black-and-white smiley face bandana around its neck. “That’s Einstein,” she says. “He’s our son.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Oh, my goodness, you’re just a sweetheart,” Barnes exclaims, patting the dog’s head.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979248\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979248 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A middle-aged Black woman speaks to a younger woman wearing a purple hair decoration.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-12-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Outside the San Leandro Bart station, BART Crisis Intervention Specialist Stephine Barnes tells an unhoused person named Cat about a nearby housing assistance program. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>She tells Cat to take her time retrieving her belongings, and emphasizes that she and Robinson are not police officers and aren’t there to pressure her to leave.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“If you guys are interested in getting on the list for permanent housing in Alameda County, there’s a place called Hedco in Hayward,” Barnes tells her. “You can get coffee in the morning and all that kind of stuff. And then they put you in line on how to get these resources for housing and all of those things Alameda County offers.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Robinson explains how to get there and hands Cat her card, telling her to call if she needs anything.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I’m really bad with resources, honestly. So this is great,” Cat says, stuffing the card in her jacket pocket and continuing her hurried packing.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“You don’t have to be out here forever,” Robinson says as she and Barnes wish Cat luck and head back toward the station.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They’ll probably never know if she follows through.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It varies widely,” Robinson says. “We could bring someone to a resource, and they literally don’t walk in the door, or we connect somebody, and they follow all the way through.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>‘Customer service on steroids’\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>In 2021, Barnes and Robinson, both seasoned BART employees, were among the first to join the crisis intervention team, now a 20-member crew dispatched throughout the 50-station transit system to offer help to people who appear to be overtly in need of it.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Finding that population has gotten a good deal easier in recent years, amid a discernible uptick in the number of people on BART’s trains and platforms experiencing homelessness or suffering from serious mental health issues — a trend that mirrors \u003ca href=\"https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/homeless-populations-surge-11-in-san-jose-and-8-17176329.php\">the overall surge\u003c/a> in the Bay Area’s unhoused population since the start of the pandemic.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART realized “a lot of the problems that were happening outside the station were coming inside the station,” says Barnes, 53, who was a station agent for 27 years, most recently at the Coliseum station in Oakland, before taking this job. “And, of course, as an agent, you see that firsthand.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART’s boots-on-the-ground outreach approach, launched in the depths of the pandemic, marks a notable foray into social services for an agency whose main objective has always been getting people from point A to point B.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The effort comes as BART struggles to recoup ridership, which \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/2024-04/202403%20MRR.pdf\">still hovers at just over 40%\u003c/a> of pre-pandemic levels, and as riders \u003ca href=\"https://www.bayareacouncil.org/press-releases/new-poll-overwhelming-support-for-more-police-on-bart-greater-focus-on-cleanliness-and-stronger-enforcement-of-rules/\">consistently say in surveys that \u003c/a>they’re most dissatisfied with how the agency addresses homelessness.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11986011\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 1920px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11986011 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg\" alt=\"Two middle-aged women in dark-blue uniforms speak to an unseen passenger on a BART train.\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1280\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut.jpg 1920w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-06_qut-1536x1024.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (left) and Stephine Barnes check on the well-being of a BART passenger they think might need help. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Those factors have prompted BART’s leaders to ratchet up funding for crisis intervention and related services — to the tune of $11 million last year, \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/docs/Homeless%20Action%20Plan.pdf\">according to the agency’s 2023 homeless action plan\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“People have seen a need for something different than what everyone was doing before, which was, ‘Call the police, call the police, call the police,’” says Barnes, who describes her job as “customer service on steroids.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Most jobs at BART have existed since the agency started running trains more than 50 years ago, she notes.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“There was nothing, though, that really addressed the mental health component or the homelessness crisis that we’re experiencing in the Bay Area,” Barnes says. “So when I first read [about the job], I thought, ‘Wow, this is like the next-level customer service.’ Because some customers need more help than just buying a Clipper Card.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The CISes, as they’re called, operate under the auspices of BART’s Police Department. But they wear distinctive, labeled uniforms and roam the stations and trains of their assigned zone in pairs, unaccompanied by sworn officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They also have no enforcement power and don’t carry any weapons.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They’re armed, instead, with latex gloves, Narcan — used to reverse opioid overdoses — and police radios in the event they need backup. And they use electronic notepads to document and tally their interactions, data the agency hopes will eventually demonstrate the still-undetermined effectiveness of the program.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Some CISes, like Robinson, 49, who worked as a BART police dispatcher for 16 years, also load their pockets with snacks to hand out. Others carry extra pairs of clean socks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Much of the help CISes offer comes in the form of referrals to a collection of social service and mental health nonprofits sprinkled throughout BART’s five-county service area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We get to do God’s work out here,” Robinson says. “We’re helping people who are unhoused, who have substance-abuse issues, mental health issues. And being able to connect them to the proper service — those who are willing to make changes in their life — it’s just really rewarding.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>Signs of distress\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>On this morning, Barnes and Robinson are about midway through an 8-hour shift, one that began at 5 a.m. and has taken them back and forth multiple times across their zone, from San Leandro to Lake Merritt stations. Much of that is spent patrolling train cars and platforms, searching for telltale signs of distress.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We pay attention to maybe some drug paraphernalia, someone who might be passed out, and check on their welfare,” Robinson says. “And then we’re also patrolling stations and just interacting with the public and building relationships with individuals that we see on a repeat basis.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>BART station agents and train operators can reach out to the CISes for help dealing with difficult but non-threatening situations, Barnes says. Passengers can also now call BART police to request help from a non-sworn officer, and dispatchers are authorized to reroute certain 911 calls to them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979245\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979245 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A person in a bathrobe and slippers walks on a train platform.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-07-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A person in a bathrobe and slippers walks along the platform of the Fruitvale BART Station — someone that Crisis Intervention Specialist Stephine Barnes says she has interacted with multiple times. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>“We can be more accessible to the public than the officers can. They’re responding to emergencies, they’re responding to fights, they’re responding to someone with a weapon,” Barnes says. “But we can take the time out. If you need to talk to me for an hour, you have me for an hour. If I need to escort you on the train, and I need to take you to a resource that’s 30, 40 minutes away, I have the time to do that.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Even when people are in their worst state, Barnes says, they’re still generally grateful to have someone checking in on them.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I mean, of course, there are times when you’re going to be called names and told ‘Get away, you’re going to get your ass kicked,’ she says. “But I got that more as a station agent than I have in this position.”\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"label":"more on homelessness ","tag":"homelessness"},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>BART says CISes “\u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2023/news20230103-2\">have a background in social work\u003c/a>” or related experience and receive a month-long training that focuses on conflict resolution and de-escalation techniques for people suffering from mental health, homelessness and substance-abuse issues.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“We’re all trained in how to come in peace. So when we approach, we approach in peace,” Barnes says. “It’s about a greeting. It’s about, ‘Hey, how are you? How are you doing? How can I best support you?’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And a lot of times, they’re very receptive to it,” she says. “But it takes time. Relationships take time.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Over roughly two hours that morning, Barnes and Robinson ask about 10 people if they need some help, including several semi-conscious riders slumped over on their seats and an older man near the entrance of the Coliseum station wrapped in a dirty blanket, muttering to himself. All, except Cat, the woman they encountered at San Leandro station, wave them off.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In the last quarter of 2023, CISes \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/2024-02/Quarterly%20Service%20Performance%20Review%20-%20Second%20Quarter%20Fiscal%20Year%202024%20-%20Presentation%20%281%29.pdf\">reported having more than 4,500 contacts\u003c/a>, of which 210 — just under 5% — resulted in verifiable connections to service providers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“It’s a game of patience. It may be the first contact somebody is ready to seek that help. Sometimes it might be the 20th contact,” says Ja’Son Scott, deputy chief of BART’s nascent Progressive Policing and Community Engagement Bureau, which encompasses the CIS program.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Scott’s bureau was launched \u003ca href=\"https://www.sfexaminer.com/archives/unarmed-bart-ambassadors-program-formalized-with-a-focus-on-community-service/article_f74c861e-326f-585d-9014-44665369b258.html\">in the fall of 2020\u003c/a>, just months after George Floyd’s murder by Minneapolis police sparked nationwide protests for racial justice and police accountability. BART says its new approach, aimed at helping to restore ridership, came in response to mounting requests from passengers for an increased safety presence in the system but with less reliance on armed officers.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979241\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979241 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two women in uniform look through an open BART train door.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-02-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (left) and Stephine Barnes speak to passengers on a BART train that’s been stalled on the platform after a man reportedly flung a bag of feces-caked laundry around the first car. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>The initiative has an annual budget of roughly $8 million, and in addition to the 20 CISes, it includes up to 10 “transit ambassadors” who also patrol the system, reporting safety concerns and “biohazards.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>I realize we didn’t have all the tools as police officers to deal with all the issues that you see in BART, and it’s not always necessary for a police officer to do that,” Scott says. “We can’t arrest our way through these problems.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>\u003cb>Outreach vs. enforcement\u003c/b>\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>BART’s social service efforts, however, haven’t always gone smoothly. The agency’s inspector general \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/sites/default/files/docs/REPORT_%24350K%20for%20Homeless%20Outreach%20Yielded%20Unclear%20Results_Final_020323.pdf\">reported\u003c/a> last year that a $350,000 multiyear contract with the Salvation Army to address homelessness resulted in just one unsheltered person entering treatment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>At the same time, BART’s Police Department has ramped up enforcement, \u003ca href=\"https://www.bart.gov/news/articles/2024/news20240328\">reporting a 62% increase in arrests\u003c/a> last year while aggressively recruiting to fill vacant positions on its force by offering higher salaries and signing bonuses.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Those developments come as riders say they want to see more sworn officers in the system.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A \u003ca href=\"https://drive.zooce.com/management/builtinapps/fileoperator.aspx?child=1&a=D3B60E43-50D3-46D5-A799-2C3CECF14238&ro=1&fid=13728646727690992504_9832503603610834240\">2023 Bay Area Council poll\u003c/a> found three-fourths of respondents would make that a high priority. Four out of five agreed that people who violate BART’s code of conduct — rules that prohibit smoking, eating, and playing loud music, among other things — should be ejected from the system. And more than two-thirds of respondents said they thought BART should focus exclusively on running a clean, safe and reliable transit operation — while letting other public agencies deal with people in crisis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Debora Allen, a BART Board director, is among that majority. A staunch supporter of tougher law enforcement within the system, Allen was one of just two board members who voted against forming the Progressive Policing Bureau. And she remains dubious of its benefits.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Look, no one wants to help people who are down and out and in crisis more than me. I think all of us on that board have the same interest,” she says. But “transit isn’t the place to start social service programs. We have counties and cities who receive hundreds of millions of dollars each year to do this social service work. We should remain focused on transit.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979246\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"wp-image-11979246 size-full\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"A Narcan case on someone's belt.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-08-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">Stephine Barnes and other crisis intervention specialists always carry Narcan, a drug used to reverse opioid overdoses. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>Allen argues that BART is using scarce dollars to deliver services to people inside the system, all but incentivizing them to stay there, while offering little in the way of data to show if the program is actually helping people.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“What I have argued all along is our first line of defense should be to keep those people out of the system,” Allen says, decrying BART’s failure to clamp down on rampant fare evasion. \u003cb>“\u003c/b>Having them wandering and sometimes even living inside of a transit system with active moving trains all the time is the most dangerous place for them to decide to live.”\u003c/p>\n\u003ch2>‘We are definitely needed’\u003c/h2>\n\u003cp>At Lake Merritt station, Barnes and Robinson are dispatched to a Dublin-Pleasanton-bound train that’s been stalled on the platform after a man reportedly flung a bag of feces-caked laundry around the first car.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>So it was all over the train car. They say he wiped it out, but it definitely needs disinfecting,” Robinson says after speaking with the train operator.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>They calmly head up the stairs and out of the station in pursuit of the man and spend about five minutes looking for him.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cb>“\u003c/b>We don’t see him anywhere. We always make an attempt to try to find somebody,” says Robinson, who had hoped to refer him to a shower and laundry truck that serves the area.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>To do this job successfully, she says, it’s important to not get too emotionally involved.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I mean, my personal outlook and training is that, you know, this is their life, their problems, their choices,” Robinson says. “So I can’t dwell necessarily on the feelings that are so associated with seeing so much human misery.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11979243\" class=\"wp-caption alignnone\" style=\"max-width: 2000px\">\u003ca href=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11979243\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg\" alt=\"Two people in dark-blue uniforms talk to a BART train conductor.\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1333\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED.jpg 2000w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-800x533.jpg 800w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1020x680.jpg 1020w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-160x107.jpg 160w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1536x1024.jpg 1536w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/03/240313-BART-CRISIS-INTERVENTION-UNIT-MD-04-KQED-1920x1280.jpg 1920w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\">\u003c/a>\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">BART Crisis Intervention Specialists Natalie Robinson (center) and Stephine Barnes speak to a BART train conductor about a man who had been causing a disturbance on the train. \u003ccite>(Martin do Nascimento/KQED)\u003c/cite>\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>But Robinson says the support she and her team offer can be a game changer — if and when people actually accept it. She recounts trying to build a relationship, over months, with a young man she often saw riding the trains in her zone, obviously intoxicated.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“And then one day, he came and asked for us and said he was ready for recovery,” she says. “He needed somebody to dial the phone for him. He needed somebody to talk to his dad for him. He was literally at his lowest point in his life. And you need a hand in those moments.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>She paused, waiting for the whine of a departing train to fade.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“So yeah, we are definitely needed,” she says. “There needs to be a 100 of us, not just 20.”\u003cbr>\n\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"floatright"},"numeric":["floatright"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11985965/we-approach-in-peace-are-barts-outreach-efforts-to-help-people-in-crisis-working","authors":["1263"],"categories":["news_8","news_1397"],"tags":["news_269","news_17725","news_27626","news_18543","news_4020","news_19903","news_20517"],"featImg":"news_11979244","label":"news"},"news_11985781":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11985781","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11985781","score":null,"sort":[1715427016000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715427016,"format":"standard","title":"Antioch Police Targeted Black People With Dogs and 40mm Launchers, Suit Alleges","headTitle":"Antioch Police Targeted Black People With Dogs and 40mm Launchers, Suit Alleges | KQED","content":"\u003cp>Two Antioch residents filed a civil rights lawsuit this week alleging city police officers intentionally injured them with a police dog and less-lethal launchers for amusement, bragged about their use of excessive force in text messages, and falsified records to conceal their misdeeds.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The officers — Morteza Amiri, Eric Rombough and Devon Wenger — were among ten Antioch and Pittsburg police officers and employees \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11958522/fbi-arrests-antioch-pittsburg-police-officers-following-indictments\">indicted by the federal government\u003c/a> last year in a sprawling misconduct case that spiraled out of an FBI investigation uncovering thousands of racist text messages. Nearly half of the Antioch Police Department was temporarily \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11974853/judge-finds-8-antioch-police-officers-tainted-by-racial-bias-reduces-criminal-charges\">placed on leave, the chief resigned, and the officers’ racial bias\u003c/a> tainted dozens of criminal cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Amiri, Rombough and Wenger’s use of force against plaintiffs Jessie Wilson and Dajon Smith was allegedly \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11947876/antioch-police-racist-texting-scandal-confirms-what-many-black-and-brown-residents-have-decried-for-years\">part of a years-long pattern\u003c/a> in which they planned and carried out excessive force against minorities, especially Black people, according to the federal lawsuit filed Wednesday in the Northern District of California. The officers allegedly referred to their targets as “gorillas,” among other derogatory language.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While the incidents in question against Wilson and Smith took place in 2021, it’s only because of the unearthed text messages that they have the evidence they need to sue, their attorney Fulvio Cajina told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The reason we’re bringing this lawsuit now is because we didn’t have the information to bring this lawsuit before,” Cajina said. “It’s only because of the FBI investigation into the Antioch Police Department that we know that there was a conspiracy amongst officers to target minorities and to intentionally violate their civil rights.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cajina said the text messages are “sickening.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Antioch Police Department and city attorney did not respond to requests for comment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Much of the officers’ planning was carried out in text messages revealed by the FBI probe in which they frequently described the desire to beat people and allow Purcy, their K-9 unit, to bite them, according to the lawsuit. In February 2019, Rombough texted Amiri, “Yeah buddy we gonna f— some people up,” court documents showed. They discussed revenge for someone “f—ing with [an officer],” and Amiri texted Rombough, “blood for blood.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In January 2021, an officer texted Amiri to ask about his interaction with a suspect. Amiri responded, “lol putting a pistol in someone’s mouth and telling them to stop stealing isn’t illegal.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilson was injured on Aug. 24, 2021, when Antioch police officers, including Amiri and Rombough, executed a search warrant to enter an Antioch residence, then entered Wilson’s locked room while he was sitting on an air mattress playing video games, according to the lawsuit. An unnamed officer pinned Wilson’s left arm down against his bed, and Rombough shot him with a 40mm less-lethal launcher, according to the indictment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A less-lethal launcher fires bean bags or sponge bullets and is intended to be used in crowd control environments, according to \u003ca href=\"https://www.lesslethal.com/products/37mm-40mm/alstac-40-detail\">the website of Pacem Defense\u003c/a>, a company selling this type of launcher.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rombough’s report about the incident differed from those written by other officers. An unnamed sergeant wrote to Rombough to critique his report, “you write that [Wilson] didn’t comply, but he clearly had his hands up at first. You need to describe way better what happened,” according to the suit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside label='Related Coverage' tag='antioch-police-department']When Antioch Police Department superiors became aware of the officers’ misdeeds, they helped them avoid discipline and accountability by concealing their actions in police reports, the suit alleges.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Smith, a Black transgender woman, encountered the officers after she allegedly stole a Maserati on Oct. 26, 2021. The incident can be seen in officer-worn body camera footage \u003ca href=\"https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/03/antioch-releases-video-of-officers-shooting-less-lethal-round-at-transgender-woman-whose-hands-were-raised/\">obtained by the Bay Area News Group\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Antioch police officers, including Wenger, surrounded Smith and the Maserati at an Antioch grocery store. Smith came out of the vehicle and faced the officers. Wenger can be heard saying to another officer, “You got the 40?” meaning the less-lethal launcher.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Smith stood by the vehicle with her hands up, and Wenger shot her in the chest with a 40mm less-lethal launcher. Antioch police officers are trained that the chest is a “potentially lethal” area to shoot someone with a 40mm less-lethal round, according to the suit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Smith begins to recoil in pain, the officers pin her to the ground and sic their police dog on her. The dog can be seen in the video tearing skin from her left arm.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rombough collected photos of people he injured shooting the 40mm less-lethal launcher and told Antioch police officers he was collecting the launcher’s spent munitions to craft an American flag, using the munitions as stars and stripes, the suit alleges.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Similarly, Amiri shared photos of victims bitten by their K9, Purcy. After one such bite in 2019, Amiri texted, “I’m gonna take more gory pics. gory [sic] pics are for personal stuff. Cleaned up pics for the case,” followed by two laughing emojis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In text messages, Amiri counted the number of consecutive dog bite photos he collected, which, according to the suit, amounted to 28.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>KQED’s Juan Carlos Lara contributed to this report.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":914,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":23},"modified":1715390977,"excerpt":"Three Antioch officers indicted in a racist text scandal are accused of intentionally injuring Black people and bragging about their use of excessive force.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Three Antioch officers indicted in a racist text scandal are accused of intentionally injuring Black people and bragging about their use of excessive force.","title":"Antioch Police Targeted Black People With Dogs and 40mm Launchers, Suit Alleges | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Antioch Police Targeted Black People With Dogs and 40mm Launchers, Suit Alleges","datePublished":"2024-05-11T04:30:16-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-10T18:29:37-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"antioch-police-targeted-black-people-with-dogs-and-40mm-launchers-suit-alleges","status":"publish","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11985781/antioch-police-targeted-black-people-with-dogs-and-40mm-launchers-suit-alleges","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>Two Antioch residents filed a civil rights lawsuit this week alleging city police officers intentionally injured them with a police dog and less-lethal launchers for amusement, bragged about their use of excessive force in text messages, and falsified records to conceal their misdeeds.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The officers — Morteza Amiri, Eric Rombough and Devon Wenger — were among ten Antioch and Pittsburg police officers and employees \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11958522/fbi-arrests-antioch-pittsburg-police-officers-following-indictments\">indicted by the federal government\u003c/a> last year in a sprawling misconduct case that spiraled out of an FBI investigation uncovering thousands of racist text messages. Nearly half of the Antioch Police Department was temporarily \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11974853/judge-finds-8-antioch-police-officers-tainted-by-racial-bias-reduces-criminal-charges\">placed on leave, the chief resigned, and the officers’ racial bias\u003c/a> tainted dozens of criminal cases.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Amiri, Rombough and Wenger’s use of force against plaintiffs Jessie Wilson and Dajon Smith was allegedly \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11947876/antioch-police-racist-texting-scandal-confirms-what-many-black-and-brown-residents-have-decried-for-years\">part of a years-long pattern\u003c/a> in which they planned and carried out excessive force against minorities, especially Black people, according to the federal lawsuit filed Wednesday in the Northern District of California. The officers allegedly referred to their targets as “gorillas,” among other derogatory language.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>While the incidents in question against Wilson and Smith took place in 2021, it’s only because of the unearthed text messages that they have the evidence they need to sue, their attorney Fulvio Cajina told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“The reason we’re bringing this lawsuit now is because we didn’t have the information to bring this lawsuit before,” Cajina said. “It’s only because of the FBI investigation into the Antioch Police Department that we know that there was a conspiracy amongst officers to target minorities and to intentionally violate their civil rights.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Cajina said the text messages are “sickening.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Antioch Police Department and city attorney did not respond to requests for comment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Much of the officers’ planning was carried out in text messages revealed by the FBI probe in which they frequently described the desire to beat people and allow Purcy, their K-9 unit, to bite them, according to the lawsuit. In February 2019, Rombough texted Amiri, “Yeah buddy we gonna f— some people up,” court documents showed. They discussed revenge for someone “f—ing with [an officer],” and Amiri texted Rombough, “blood for blood.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In January 2021, an officer texted Amiri to ask about his interaction with a suspect. Amiri responded, “lol putting a pistol in someone’s mouth and telling them to stop stealing isn’t illegal.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Wilson was injured on Aug. 24, 2021, when Antioch police officers, including Amiri and Rombough, executed a search warrant to enter an Antioch residence, then entered Wilson’s locked room while he was sitting on an air mattress playing video games, according to the lawsuit. An unnamed officer pinned Wilson’s left arm down against his bed, and Rombough shot him with a 40mm less-lethal launcher, according to the indictment.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>A less-lethal launcher fires bean bags or sponge bullets and is intended to be used in crowd control environments, according to \u003ca href=\"https://www.lesslethal.com/products/37mm-40mm/alstac-40-detail\">the website of Pacem Defense\u003c/a>, a company selling this type of launcher.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rombough’s report about the incident differed from those written by other officers. An unnamed sergeant wrote to Rombough to critique his report, “you write that [Wilson] didn’t comply, but he clearly had his hands up at first. You need to describe way better what happened,” according to the suit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"label":"Related Coverage ","tag":"antioch-police-department"},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>When Antioch Police Department superiors became aware of the officers’ misdeeds, they helped them avoid discipline and accountability by concealing their actions in police reports, the suit alleges.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Smith, a Black transgender woman, encountered the officers after she allegedly stole a Maserati on Oct. 26, 2021. The incident can be seen in officer-worn body camera footage \u003ca href=\"https://www.mercurynews.com/2023/12/03/antioch-releases-video-of-officers-shooting-less-lethal-round-at-transgender-woman-whose-hands-were-raised/\">obtained by the Bay Area News Group\u003c/a>.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Antioch police officers, including Wenger, surrounded Smith and the Maserati at an Antioch grocery store. Smith came out of the vehicle and faced the officers. Wenger can be heard saying to another officer, “You got the 40?” meaning the less-lethal launcher.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Smith stood by the vehicle with her hands up, and Wenger shot her in the chest with a 40mm less-lethal launcher. Antioch police officers are trained that the chest is a “potentially lethal” area to shoot someone with a 40mm less-lethal round, according to the suit.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>When Smith begins to recoil in pain, the officers pin her to the ground and sic their police dog on her. The dog can be seen in the video tearing skin from her left arm.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Rombough collected photos of people he injured shooting the 40mm less-lethal launcher and told Antioch police officers he was collecting the launcher’s spent munitions to craft an American flag, using the munitions as stars and stripes, the suit alleges.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Similarly, Amiri shared photos of victims bitten by their K9, Purcy. After one such bite in 2019, Amiri texted, “I’m gonna take more gory pics. gory [sic] pics are for personal stuff. Cleaned up pics for the case,” followed by two laughing emojis.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In text messages, Amiri counted the number of consecutive dog bite photos he collected, which, according to the suit, amounted to 28.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003cem>KQED’s Juan Carlos Lara contributed to this report.\u003c/em>\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11985781/antioch-police-targeted-black-people-with-dogs-and-40mm-launchers-suit-alleges","authors":["11690"],"categories":["news_6188","news_8"],"tags":["news_19122","news_32621","news_17725"],"featImg":"news_11947885","label":"news"},"news_11985347":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11985347","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11985347","score":null,"sort":[1715196649000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1715196649,"format":"standard","title":"Neighbors to Rally in Support of Black SF Man Who Received Racist Threats","headTitle":"Neighbors to Rally in Support of Black SF Man Who Received Racist Threats | KQED","content":"\u003cp>Terry Williams is a born-and-raised San Franciscan — he’s called Alamo Square home his whole life. But on Sunday, he found a package containing racist slurs, death threats and a doll painted in blackface outside his house, telling him to “get out.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They said they’re going to exterminate me, eradicate me, that I don’t belong in this neighborhood,” said Williams, 49. The essence of the message, he said, was, “It’s not a Black neighborhood no more — get out of here, you don’t belong here.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The doll had the words “Get out of the Alamo Square district” on the front, as well as a small plastic grenade and Ku Klux Klan imagery.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11985353\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\" style=\"max-width: 710px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11985353\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect.png\" alt=\"A person wearing all black walks on a sidewalk\" width=\"710\" height=\"554\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect.png 710w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect-160x125.png 160w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 710px) 100vw, 710px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A neighbor’s security camera footage shows an individual suspected of leaving the racist package at Terry Williams’ home on April 26. A similarly dressed individual was seen on security camera footage after the May 5 incident, but police have not yet retrieved the footage, Katrina Queirolo told KQED.\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>It was the second threatening package left at Williams’ home in the last two weeks; early on April 26, he found the first, which also contained a doll painted in blackface — a racist caricature of Black people stemming from 19th-century minstrel shows — with a noose around its neck, racist slurs written on the doll and printouts of racist imagery.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Since then, Williams said life has been more stressful for him and his parents.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I see it in my mom; she’s smoking cigarettes,” Williams said. “And it’s just little things like she’ll tell me, ‘Where are you going? You call me when you get where you’re going.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On each occasion, Williams called the police, who came and retrieved the packages. Officers are investigating both incidents as potential hate crimes but are “unable to confirm that these incidents are connected,” a San Francisco Police Department spokesperson wrote in an email.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Supporters plan to rally in Alamo Square Park at 10:30 a.m. Saturday to “raise awareness” of the racist threats against Williams and pressure police to prioritize the investigations, Williams’ neighbor Katrina Queirolo told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I hope they do their job, but in my opinion — what I’ve been through with SFPD and my history with trying to report stuff and get stuff handled for Black people — they don’t do it,” Williams said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>After Williams found the first doll, Queirolo started an online fundraiser to “install a great security system (with cameras)” and “help take some financial pressure off the family during a very difficult and scary time,” according to the GoFundMe page. The fundraiser had more than $10,000 by Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When it happened, I think myself and quite a few other neighbors were, obviously, absolutely horrified,” Queirolo said in an interview. “It’s such a disgusting thing that someone would have this much hatred and also just extremely scary that they could be in our neighborhood.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Williams runs a dog walking business and said he has had racist and unfriendly encounters with dog owners and residents over the years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I’ve been called n— a few times, countless times. I had a lady call the police on me up here before, tried to say my dogs attacked her and her 18-pound yorkie. She called the police on me, tried to get me arrested three times for assault and battery,” Williams said. The\u003ca href=\"https://sfbayview.com/2021/06/dog-walking-while-black-in-sf-parks-why-we-need-the-caren-act/\"> \u003cem>San Francisco Bay View\u003c/em>, a local Black newspaper, reported\u003c/a> the alleged 2021 incident.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Williams said he wanted the woman to be charged under \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/arts/13883048/the-caren-act-is-real-and-its-coming-for-racist-911-callers\">the CAREN Act\u003c/a>, a local ordinance against racially biased 911 calls and was concerned to find months later that no report had been filed. San Francisco police did not immediately respond to questions about the incident.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Rev. Amos Brown, president of the San Francisco branch of the NAACP and pastor of the Third Baptist Church near Alamo Square, said it’s important to keep in mind the neighborhood’s history when discussing racist acts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Take note that this area has been gentrified. Here in Western Addition, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11957757/why-san-franciscos-fillmore-district-is-no-longer-the-harlem-of-the-west\">the Old Fillmore, the Harlem of the West\u003c/a>,” Brown said. “Black folks were pushed out under that so-called redevelopment program that was started in 1948.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Brown added: “That was not about redevelopment, urban renewal — it was about Black removal.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Sunday, Williams showed up at Third Baptist Church “to find refuge in the midst of his trauma,” Brown said. The church prayed for him, and Williams spoke passionately about what he had experienced, Brown said. Williams said he hadn’t planned to speak when he went to the church but felt moved to.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“There have always been different acts of injustice and discrimination against Blacks in this city,” Brown said. He mentioned \u003ca href=\"https://sfstandard.com/2024/04/30/racist-slurs-show-blind-eye-san-francisco-schools/\">a recent incident at Lakeshore Elementary School\u003c/a> in which a white parent threatened a 10-year-old Black child and said he’s received many calls from parents of Black children about racist incidents at San Francisco schools in recent weeks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“San Francisco is not as progressive and liberal as it claims to be.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":916,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":22},"modified":1715197652,"excerpt":"Police are investigating packages containing racist slurs, death threats and dolls painted in blackface as potential hate crimes against a dog walker in Alamo Square.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Police are investigating packages containing racist slurs, death threats and dolls painted in blackface as potential hate crimes against a dog walker in Alamo Square.","title":"Neighbors to Rally in Support of Black SF Man Who Received Racist Threats | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"Neighbors to Rally in Support of Black SF Man Who Received Racist Threats","datePublished":"2024-05-08T12:30:49-07:00","dateModified":"2024-05-08T12:47:32-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"san-francisco-police-urged-to-take-alarming-racist-threats-seriously","status":"publish","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"articleAge":"0","nprStoryId":"kqed-11985347","path":"/news/11985347/san-francisco-police-urged-to-take-alarming-racist-threats-seriously","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>Terry Williams is a born-and-raised San Franciscan — he’s called Alamo Square home his whole life. But on Sunday, he found a package containing racist slurs, death threats and a doll painted in blackface outside his house, telling him to “get out.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“They said they’re going to exterminate me, eradicate me, that I don’t belong in this neighborhood,” said Williams, 49. The essence of the message, he said, was, “It’s not a Black neighborhood no more — get out of here, you don’t belong here.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The doll had the words “Get out of the Alamo Square district” on the front, as well as a small plastic grenade and Ku Klux Klan imagery.\u003c/p>\n\u003cfigure id=\"attachment_11985353\" class=\"wp-caption alignright\" style=\"max-width: 710px\">\u003cimg loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" class=\"size-full wp-image-11985353\" src=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect.png\" alt=\"A person wearing all black walks on a sidewalk\" width=\"710\" height=\"554\" srcset=\"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect.png 710w, https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2024/05/terry-williams-suspect-160x125.png 160w\" sizes=\"(max-width: 710px) 100vw, 710px\">\u003cfigcaption class=\"wp-caption-text\">A neighbor’s security camera footage shows an individual suspected of leaving the racist package at Terry Williams’ home on April 26. A similarly dressed individual was seen on security camera footage after the May 5 incident, but police have not yet retrieved the footage, Katrina Queirolo told KQED.\u003c/figcaption>\u003c/figure>\n\u003cp>It was the second threatening package left at Williams’ home in the last two weeks; early on April 26, he found the first, which also contained a doll painted in blackface — a racist caricature of Black people stemming from 19th-century minstrel shows — with a noose around its neck, racist slurs written on the doll and printouts of racist imagery.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Since then, Williams said life has been more stressful for him and his parents.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I see it in my mom; she’s smoking cigarettes,” Williams said. “And it’s just little things like she’ll tell me, ‘Where are you going? You call me when you get where you’re going.’”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On each occasion, Williams called the police, who came and retrieved the packages. Officers are investigating both incidents as potential hate crimes but are “unable to confirm that these incidents are connected,” a San Francisco Police Department spokesperson wrote in an email.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Supporters plan to rally in Alamo Square Park at 10:30 a.m. Saturday to “raise awareness” of the racist threats against Williams and pressure police to prioritize the investigations, Williams’ neighbor Katrina Queirolo told KQED.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I hope they do their job, but in my opinion — what I’ve been through with SFPD and my history with trying to report stuff and get stuff handled for Black people — they don’t do it,” Williams said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>After Williams found the first doll, Queirolo started an online fundraiser to “install a great security system (with cameras)” and “help take some financial pressure off the family during a very difficult and scary time,” according to the GoFundMe page. The fundraiser had more than $10,000 by Wednesday.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“When it happened, I think myself and quite a few other neighbors were, obviously, absolutely horrified,” Queirolo said in an interview. “It’s such a disgusting thing that someone would have this much hatred and also just extremely scary that they could be in our neighborhood.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Williams runs a dog walking business and said he has had racist and unfriendly encounters with dog owners and residents over the years.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“I’ve been called n— a few times, countless times. I had a lady call the police on me up here before, tried to say my dogs attacked her and her 18-pound yorkie. She called the police on me, tried to get me arrested three times for assault and battery,” Williams said. The\u003ca href=\"https://sfbayview.com/2021/06/dog-walking-while-black-in-sf-parks-why-we-need-the-caren-act/\"> \u003cem>San Francisco Bay View\u003c/em>, a local Black newspaper, reported\u003c/a> the alleged 2021 incident.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Williams said he wanted the woman to be charged under \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/arts/13883048/the-caren-act-is-real-and-its-coming-for-racist-911-callers\">the CAREN Act\u003c/a>, a local ordinance against racially biased 911 calls and was concerned to find months later that no report had been filed. San Francisco police did not immediately respond to questions about the incident.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The Rev. Amos Brown, president of the San Francisco branch of the NAACP and pastor of the Third Baptist Church near Alamo Square, said it’s important to keep in mind the neighborhood’s history when discussing racist acts.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Take note that this area has been gentrified. Here in Western Addition, \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11957757/why-san-franciscos-fillmore-district-is-no-longer-the-harlem-of-the-west\">the Old Fillmore, the Harlem of the West\u003c/a>,” Brown said. “Black folks were pushed out under that so-called redevelopment program that was started in 1948.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Brown added: “That was not about redevelopment, urban renewal — it was about Black removal.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>On Sunday, Williams showed up at Third Baptist Church “to find refuge in the midst of his trauma,” Brown said. The church prayed for him, and Williams spoke passionately about what he had experienced, Brown said. Williams said he hadn’t planned to speak when he went to the church but felt moved to.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“There have always been different acts of injustice and discrimination against Blacks in this city,” Brown said. He mentioned \u003ca href=\"https://sfstandard.com/2024/04/30/racist-slurs-show-blind-eye-san-francisco-schools/\">a recent incident at Lakeshore Elementary School\u003c/a> in which a white parent threatened a 10-year-old Black child and said he’s received many calls from parents of Black children about racist incidents at San Francisco schools in recent weeks.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“San Francisco is not as progressive and liberal as it claims to be.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11985347/san-francisco-police-urged-to-take-alarming-racist-threats-seriously","authors":["11896"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_17725","news_5660","news_19216","news_38"],"featImg":"news_11985352","label":"news"},"news_11983846":{"type":"posts","id":"news_11983846","meta":{"index":"posts_1716263798","site":"news","id":"11983846","score":null,"sort":[1713909559000]},"parent":0,"labelTerm":{"site":"news"},"blocks":[],"publishDate":1713909559,"format":"standard","title":"State Prisons Offset New Inmate Wage Hikes by Cutting Hours for Some Workers","headTitle":"State Prisons Offset New Inmate Wage Hikes by Cutting Hours for Some Workers | KQED","content":"\u003cp>California prison officials recently boosted wages for tens of thousands of incarcerated workers. Most, however, will still make less than $1 per hour, and many may not see an increase in total earnings because their hours will be cut.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pay rates now generally range from $0.16 to $0.74 per hour, depending on skill levels, double the previous decades-old rate, according to \u003ca href=\"https://www.cdcr.ca.gov/regulations/wp-content/uploads/sites/171/2024/04/Inmate-Pay_Approval.pdf\">new regulations\u003c/a> that went into effect on April 16.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The increase is intended to incentivize incarcerated people to take jobs for their own rehabilitation, said the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation, which also eliminated all unpaid job assignments.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“New wages will also help workers meet restitution payments for crime victims and save more money in preparation for release,” Tessa Outhyse, a CDCR spokesperson, said in a statement. “In addition to a paycheck, work assignments build technical and social skills, instill accountability and responsibility, and prepare incarcerated people for careers after release.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nearly 39,000 incarcerated people have job assignments in state prisons, doing everything from construction and maintenance to custodial and food services.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[ad fullwidth]\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>About 1,200 incarcerated firefighters, who are on a separate pay scale, will also now make anywhere from $5.80 to $10.24 a day, a significant increase over the previous daily range of $2.90 to $5.13. Cal Fire also pays an additional $1 per hour for crews battling active fires.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>[aside label=\"more on California prisons\" tag=\"cdcr\"]However, an overall pay increase may not materialize for many incarcerated workers. Outhyse confirmed that as CDCR boosts wages, it also plans to reduce up to three-quarters of its full-time job offerings to half-time — although it said it is “not conducting a wholesale reduction.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“CDCR is exploring the introduction of some flexibility in this area to accommodate institution budget requirements as well as the possibility of increasing inmates’ flexibility to participate in rehabilitative program assignments,” the agency wrote in response to public comment concerns.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prisoner rights advocates \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967728/california-prison-officials-aim-to-raise-hourly-minimum-wage-to-at-least-16-cents\">pushed for a much higher pay increase\u003c/a>, one closer to California’s minimum wage of $16 an hour, without reductions in full-time jobs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Jacob Hutt, an attorney with the Prison Law Office, said the new wages are not setting up people in custody to succeed when released.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“By paying people a slave wage right now, they are all but ensuring that people are going to end up in poverty once they leave custody,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In addition, CDCR often \u003ca href=\"https://www.cdcr.ca.gov/family-resources/send-money/\">deducts up to 55%\u003c/a> of an incarcerated workers’ wages for administrative costs and restitution fees for crime victims, Hutt added, further reducing their net pay and ability to purchase canteen items.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Even when you don’t consider the fact that so many of these workers are actually not going to receive any pay increase because they’re being forced from full-time to half-time, the minimum pay raise is just so ridiculously low,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\n","stats":{"hasVideo":false,"hasChartOrMap":false,"hasAudio":false,"hasPolis":false,"wordCount":503,"hasGoogleForm":false,"hasGallery":false,"hasHearkenModule":false,"iframeSrcs":[],"paragraphCount":15},"modified":1714152949,"excerpt":"Starting this month, pay rates will now generally range from $0.16 to $0.74 per hour, double the previous decades-old rate. But many full-time jobs will be cut to half-time.","headData":{"twImgId":"","twTitle":"","ogTitle":"","ogImgId":"","twDescription":"","description":"Starting this month, pay rates will now generally range from $0.16 to $0.74 per hour, double the previous decades-old rate. But many full-time jobs will be cut to half-time.","title":"State Prisons Offset New Inmate Wage Hikes by Cutting Hours for Some Workers | KQED","ogDescription":"","schema":{"@context":"http://schema.org","@type":"NewsArticle","headline":"State Prisons Offset New Inmate Wage Hikes by Cutting Hours for Some Workers","datePublished":"2024-04-23T14:59:19-07:00","dateModified":"2024-04-26T10:35:49-07:00","image":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png","isAccessibleForFree":"True","publisher":{"@type":"NewsMediaOrganization","@id":"https://www.kqed.org/#organization","name":"KQED","url":"https://www.kqed.org","logo":"https://cdn.kqed.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/KQED-OG-Image@1x.png"}}},"guestAuthors":[],"slug":"state-prisons-offset-new-inmate-wage-hikes-by-cutting-hours-for-some-workers","status":"publish","audioUrl":"https://traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/0af137ef-751e-4b19-a055-aaef00d2d578/ffca7e9f-6831-41c5-bcaf-aaef00f5a073/d363e635-0274-4e10-aea0-b15a00f64069/audio.mp3","excludeFromSiteSearch":"Include","sticky":false,"WpOldSlug":"state-prisons-offset-new-inmate-wage-hikes-by-cutting-hours-for-workers","articleAge":"0","path":"/news/11983846/state-prisons-offset-new-inmate-wage-hikes-by-cutting-hours-for-some-workers","audioTrackLength":null,"parsedContent":[{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003cp>California prison officials recently boosted wages for tens of thousands of incarcerated workers. Most, however, will still make less than $1 per hour, and many may not see an increase in total earnings because their hours will be cut.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Pay rates now generally range from $0.16 to $0.74 per hour, depending on skill levels, double the previous decades-old rate, according to \u003ca href=\"https://www.cdcr.ca.gov/regulations/wp-content/uploads/sites/171/2024/04/Inmate-Pay_Approval.pdf\">new regulations\u003c/a> that went into effect on April 16.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>The increase is intended to incentivize incarcerated people to take jobs for their own rehabilitation, said the California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation, which also eliminated all unpaid job assignments.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“New wages will also help workers meet restitution payments for crime victims and save more money in preparation for release,” Tessa Outhyse, a CDCR spokesperson, said in a statement. “In addition to a paycheck, work assignments build technical and social skills, instill accountability and responsibility, and prepare incarcerated people for careers after release.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Nearly 39,000 incarcerated people have job assignments in state prisons, doing everything from construction and maintenance to custodial and food services.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"ad","attributes":{"named":{"label":"fullwidth"},"numeric":["fullwidth"]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>About 1,200 incarcerated firefighters, who are on a separate pay scale, will also now make anywhere from $5.80 to $10.24 a day, a significant increase over the previous daily range of $2.90 to $5.13. Cal Fire also pays an additional $1 per hour for crews battling active fires.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\u003c/div>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"component","content":"","name":"aside","attributes":{"named":{"label":"more on California prisons ","tag":"cdcr"},"numeric":[]}},{"type":"contentString","content":"\u003cdiv class=\"post-body\">\u003cp>However, an overall pay increase may not materialize for many incarcerated workers. Outhyse confirmed that as CDCR boosts wages, it also plans to reduce up to three-quarters of its full-time job offerings to half-time — although it said it is “not conducting a wholesale reduction.”\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“CDCR is exploring the introduction of some flexibility in this area to accommodate institution budget requirements as well as the possibility of increasing inmates’ flexibility to participate in rehabilitative program assignments,” the agency wrote in response to public comment concerns.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Prisoner rights advocates \u003ca href=\"https://www.kqed.org/news/11967728/california-prison-officials-aim-to-raise-hourly-minimum-wage-to-at-least-16-cents\">pushed for a much higher pay increase\u003c/a>, one closer to California’s minimum wage of $16 an hour, without reductions in full-time jobs.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>Jacob Hutt, an attorney with the Prison Law Office, said the new wages are not setting up people in custody to succeed when released.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“By paying people a slave wage right now, they are all but ensuring that people are going to end up in poverty once they leave custody,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>In addition, CDCR often \u003ca href=\"https://www.cdcr.ca.gov/family-resources/send-money/\">deducts up to 55%\u003c/a> of an incarcerated workers’ wages for administrative costs and restitution fees for crime victims, Hutt added, further reducing their net pay and ability to purchase canteen items.\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>\u003c/p>\n\u003cp>“Even when you don’t consider the fact that so many of these workers are actually not going to receive any pay increase because they’re being forced from full-time to half-time, the minimum pay raise is just so ridiculously low,” he said.\u003c/p>\n\n\u003c/div>\u003c/p>","attributes":{"named":{},"numeric":[]}}],"link":"/news/11983846/state-prisons-offset-new-inmate-wage-hikes-by-cutting-hours-for-some-workers","authors":["8659"],"categories":["news_8"],"tags":["news_26658","news_616","news_1629","news_17725","news_27626"],"featImg":"news_11983401","label":"news"}},"programsReducer":{"possible":{"id":"possible","title":"Possible","info":"Possible is hosted by entrepreneur Reid Hoffman and writer Aria Finger. 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